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Author Topic: Graphical User Interface for modfying files  (Read 14147 times)
boomerro
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« on: December 20, 2012, 12:03:58 AM »

Is anyone working on something that would make modifying files easier and more user friendly?  Id like to see a more user friendly graphical interface for DIY tuning.  In other communities, like the Subaru community, free tuning softwares like romraider logger and http://www.romraider.com/ and EcuFlash (similar to nefmoto flashing software in idea) are really keeping those communities DIY friendly.  The b5 s4 community could really benefit from something like this.   A reasonably priced tuning software would be very much so welcome, something like DSMLink or HPTuners or COBB Pro Accessport (hand held one is crappy ots tunes)?

I have read until my eyes were bleeding on the Romraider forums because of how simple and user friendly their setup is its much easier to communicate tuning ideas and concepts.  There are giant articles on the knock strategies and other aspects of tuning a turbo Subaru.  While the S4 Wiki has some great tuning stuff, it is lacking detail and depth that the Subaru community has.

I think there is great entrepreneurial possibility for you tech savvy guys to build a tuning software and market it to the s4 community, or release it for free if you are so generous with your time.

Really looking forward to what you guys have to say about this, or perhaps point my nose in the right direction if people are already working on this.
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littco
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« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2012, 02:08:04 AM »

Tuner pro rt. you need the .xdfs but once you've got that or made them up it'll do all you want! Show in graphical, 3d, 2d or in decimal tables.

Not sure you need much more.
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prj
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« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2012, 06:54:41 AM »

Never going to happen, because the Bosch ME7 ECU is a million times more refined and complex than any of the japanese stuff of the same era.
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julex
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« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2012, 07:14:12 AM »

eurodyne has software out there to do just this, in a very limited fashion but enough for casual user, but they lock it to their hardware dongle and sell it for cool $900...and it gets locked to particular vehicle too so you can't tune any other vehicles.
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nyet
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« Reply #4 on: December 20, 2012, 08:44:27 AM »

Maestro attempts to do this, but like prj said, there are no shortcuts in ME.
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fredrik_a
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« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2012, 08:51:48 AM »

Maestro attempts to do this, but like prj said, there are no shortcuts in ME.

Any insight in how the UI for vehicle manufacturers look like? I have a hard time seeing for instance Audi and Volvo coding "off-line" in the program file like we do? Seems very time consuming...?  Undecided
I have no clue what it might look like...?
« Last Edit: December 20, 2012, 08:53:30 AM by fredrik_a » Logged
julex
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« Reply #6 on: December 20, 2012, 09:00:23 AM »

Any insight in how the UI for vehicle manufacturers look like? I have a hard time seeing for instance Audi and Volvo coding "off-line" in the program file like we do? Seems very time consuming...?  Undecided
I have no clue what it might look like...?

I am sure they have proper hardware emulators that allow them to make changes real time as engine is running. As a software, Tunerpro is perfectly fine for off line coding, it is all you need. To take is a step further... somebody would have to essentially write an engine simulator that would run the ME program in an interpreter... if somebody pulls something like this off, I am sure he will find himself employed by car manufacturer 1/2 way into the project.
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littco
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« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2012, 09:08:02 AM »

Any insight in how the UI for vehicle manufacturers look like? I have a hard time seeing for instance Audi and Volvo coding "off-line" in the program file like we do? Seems very time consuming...?  Undecided
I have no clue what it might look like...?

They just use a real time emulator. I'd imagine they stick the engine to a dyno and tune it in situ.
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prj
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« Reply #8 on: December 20, 2012, 09:09:03 AM »

Any insight in how the UI for vehicle manufacturers look like? I have a hard time seeing for instance Audi and Volvo coding "off-line" in the program file like we do? Seems very time consuming...?  Undecided
I have no clue what it might look like...?

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jimmcgee5
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« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2012, 10:16:01 AM »

I am sure they have proper hardware emulators that allow them to make changes real time as engine is running. As a software, Tunerpro is perfectly fine for off line coding, it is all you need. To take is a step further... somebody would have to essentially write an engine simulator that would run the ME program in an interpreter... if somebody pulls something like this off, I am sure he will find himself employed by car manufacturer 1/2 way into the project.

I dont know how this has not been done by now , after all its all digital signals , so what we need is a digital engine that you load the rom into  Smiley, a slider for the fuel and boost , and other stuff , and a screen for the output , so when you up the boost or fuel or 100 and 1 other things , you can see what happens  Grin

dear Santa , make it happin please  Cool
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nyet
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« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2012, 12:44:42 PM »

There are too many feedback control loops in Motronic (compared to the very rudimentary feedback loops in japanese and american ECUs).

You can't simply add a slider and expect the software to be able to automatically adjust all the associated maps that need to be changed, even with an engine dyno.

at the end of the day, proper calibration of Motronic requires a human. In theory, a lot of it can be automated (with the proper equipment, and man months if not years of development effort), but certainly not all of it.
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ME7.1 tuning guide (READ FIRST)
ECUx Plot
ME7Sum checksum checker/corrrector for ME7.x

Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your experience.
boomerro
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« Reply #11 on: December 30, 2012, 06:11:10 PM »

Tuner pro rt. you need the .xdfs but once you've got that or made them up it'll do all you want! Show in graphical, 3d, 2d or in decimal tables.

Not sure you need much more.

I guess what I am talking about is a bit more user friendly version of Tuner Pro, with real names instead of stuff like KRKTE.  Am I the only one who thinks its a pain to try and remember a random assortment of letters rather than a map name?


edit* never mind, how did I miss the "view by" hahaha, ops!  Still would be nice to have real map names, rather than letters Tongue it would be nice to get it to show the "description" rather than the random assortment of letters.

« Last Edit: December 30, 2012, 06:17:29 PM by boomerro » Logged

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littco
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« Reply #12 on: December 31, 2012, 12:21:05 AM »

Maps are only listed as letters ie krkte as the person that created the .xdf named them like that! Take the time and change them to what ever you want!
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phila_dot
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« Reply #13 on: December 31, 2012, 12:37:48 AM »

I guess what I am talking about is a bit more user friendly version of Tuner Pro, with real names instead of stuff like KRKTE.  Am I the only one who thinks its a pain to try and remember a random assortment of letters rather than a map name?


edit* never mind, how did I miss the "view by" hahaha, ops!  Still would be nice to have real map names, rather than letters Tongue it would be nice to get it to show the "description" rather than the random assortment of letters.



If you study ME7 at all, what sense does it make to avoid the FR acronyms. It just adds to confusion and ambiguity.

It's not nonsense, start studying and it will become second nature. There is a pattern.
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prj
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« Reply #14 on: December 31, 2012, 11:38:13 AM »

If you study ME7 at all, what sense does it make to avoid the FR acronyms. It just adds to confusion and ambiguity.

It's not nonsense, start studying and it will become second nature. There is a pattern.

The pattern is even better if you know German.

KFZW for example would be Kennfeld Zündwinkel. Kennfeld is a map and Zündwinkel literally means ignition angle.
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