NefMoto

Hi.
I have tuned lots of vag 1.8t me7.
I have only 2 cars what do this.
When I accelerate all is ok but 4,5 and 6 gears I feel hesitation and i see 116 block that it closes tb.

I can send files if someone want to look.

Here is log, there you see how lamda reacts.
Tested:
n75
bypass
maf
fuelpump
measured fuel pressure
lamda.

Overboost or going too lean? Try logging lambda actual vs requested.

Actual and reg lamdas are almost same
about 0.8-0.78

hi

I have experienced this problem on one car where the injector opening time got to high - in my case the fuelpump couldnt deliver enough and the opening time to meet reqeusted lambda got to high and the ecu started to close the TB

br
Christian

I change injectors and all is ok.
I just think how this can be possible because stock hw.
I think we can ger 220 whit stock fuel hardware

220HP is possible on 180HP stock engine with stock components or on 110kW engine with K04 turbo and maybe injectors - i dont know which you have ...

120 kw bfb engine.
Audi a4 8e 2005 my.

Turbo and injector size?

Injectors are 265cc and stock turbo (k03-015)
But in bfb engine boost does not raise fuelpressure so if it have 4 bar and you get 1.5 bar boost real fuelpressure is only 2.5bar, maybe this is the reason.

of course my friend this is the problem the fuel isn't enought for the engine. Try to log channel 33 the addaptation values of the fuel to see if it is enought. Regards.

Wrong place...

Good afternoon.
After searching the web for about 2 months I found your problem which is exactly the same with mine.

2 months ago i bought a used A4 B7 AVANT (8ED) QUATTRO (2005) 1.8T BFB (120kw), which is the logical next step from my previous car which was an A3 8L 1.8T AUM (REVO STAGE 1) (sold with 277.000 km and the 150.000 after tuning)

After upgrading to stage 1 I had the same problems as you in 4,5,6 gear whenever I push the throttle a little more faster than slowly (things start to go bad when turbo pressure builds up).

I have changed a fuel pump , CAT, MAF, cleaned and tested the 270cc injectors, PCV valves, plugs, 2 fuel filters (1 6 bars and 1 original Audi at 4 bars) at a cost of almost 1000 euro.
My pressure is OK and my lambda is OK.

The car is improved somehow (since everything is new), but I still have the problem.

My fuel injectors stay open 25-30 ms in order to deliver the fuel which obviously is not enough.

The tuner said that the car should have delivered 190-200 hp with stock injectors, which obviously is not happening in my case when on 4,5,6 gear and especially when the the road is climbing

How did you solve the problem?
Did use 310 or 380 cc injectors?
If yes did you change the tuning?

I will be more than thankful if you could help.

By the way are you Greek like me?

Thanks in advance.

BFB injectors are too small even for 200HP. You should use at least BEX injectors or if you can buy cheaply the ones from BAM...

Thanks for the immediate response.

I have found used injectors of BEX engine (06A906031BA) which are rated at 317cc @ 4 Bar and BAM injectors (06A906031BC) 380cc @ 3 bar at almost the same price (about 100 euro).

BFB has 4 bar FPR inside the fuel filter and no return line. Is it safe using the BAM injectors which are rated at 3 bar?

I also thought of using a fuel filter with 6 bar FPR, since I've heard Audi is using it instead of the 4 bar filter.

Thanks again

You should consider your fuel pump flow if you want to change fuel pressure. I would just take BAM injectors and tune properly for your setup (including fuel pressure).

Thanks for the advice.
I will go with BAM injectors and retune.

Thank you very much.
I will have to call REVO in Greece to see if they have an upgrade 380cc setup for my ECU REVO file (8E0 909 518 AQ 0020).

I will report when done so.

Thanks again fro your help.

Alex

DELETED

BAM injectors fitted (used, cleaned, metered) and REVO flashed 380cc map.
The car is now better, fuel trims injector timings are better, but the car isn't running perfectly.
When WOT it overshoots once the requested boost pressure and then it it matched.
Also there is a vibration under heavy acceleration (which we are unable to understand if it is engine or transmission  driven).
The vibration could be also reported as an oscillation of the engine output.
REVO says they cant't figure out the cause, so I will be driving my Audi for a few hundred of km is order to investigate the possible cause.
They also mentioned that I should investigate my dual mass freewheel and clutch, the main axle and rear differential (my AVANT is Quattro)  (=> total >6000 euro) but I think I can't be so unlucky....
Finally the said that the IAT raised to 90oC during testing (meaning I should also test my inter cooler), but today it was an extremely hot and humid day for tuning (T>34oC and relative humidity >75%).

Any opinions/suggestions would be appreciated.

Alex
 ???

If I were you I would try different (non REVO) tune.

aloakos, have you checked an oil intervention in flame chamber? This could be regular knock if the oil took place there because of the very small amount of oil can reduce significantly effective octane of air/fuel mixture.

I've even bumped into with this effect in my friend's Audi A4.

Sorry for the late reply,
Do you mean engine oil entering the combustion chamber of the engine via the piston springs or the spark plug?
I haven't seen any drop in oil level. I had a minor leak around #1 Spark plug coming from the valve cover gasket  which I have replaced.
I haven't done an engine compression test.

Also after changing the injectors to 380cc my fuel trims goes to -19,5% which indicates that the injectors haven't been registered or the new REVO map is not for 380cc.....

I am trying to figure out how to handle the issue with REVO.

I will report tomorrow that we have a meeting.

I also attach 5 runs logs made with APR logging methodology ( https://www.goapr.com/support/datalogging.php).

All runs made with 3rd gear in an uphill road.
For each run 2 attempts were made, one with full throttle and one with part throttle (ex. 51 means 5th run 1st attempt, 52 means %th run 2nd attempt).

When accelerating with part throttle (about 30%) the acceleration is much better.
Also when the specified pressure is >2000mb the hesitation starts and Adv.Timing is retarding >3o.
Finally at 2500 rpm there is a major overboost and (+250mb) and the actual lambda drops rapidly.

I will keep you informed. >:(

You have much better tuners in Greece, just ask REVO for refund and buy custom tune for example at www.revlimit.gr

As I said I was a happy REVO customer with my A3.
I was looking for a "safe" option.
My ride to work is mountainous road and all I needed was the power to overtake trucks end enjoy the ride.
I wasn't looking for the fastest setup.

REVO guys are willing and helpful but I think they aren't able/qualified to find the root of the problem, which probably is the remap, and they blame all the other systems of the car.

Tomorrow it will be my final effort with REVO.

Thank you very much.

PS does anyone has any ideas by checking the Logs? Any help would be great in order to make a case with my problem.

Get some ME7L logs. I don't see any timing data, torque request, load request, O2 sensor voltages etc. etc. etc.

I'm also not seeing any issues in those logs, or nothing like what you describe other than some overboost (which isn't even causing throttle cut).

What, exactly, is your complaint?

Thank you very much for the fast reply.
I used the following logging method :
ROUND 1 LOGGING:
Use for Boost and Fueling
Diagnosis
Item # Vag-Com
Block # Description
*Not Applicable to EA888 TSI/TFSI Engines.
1 001-1 Engine Speed
2 014-3 Misfire Sum
3 031-1 Lambda, Current Value
4 054-3 Accelerator Pedal Position
5 054-4 Throttle Plate Angle
6 101-3 Injection Timing (Median)
7* 103-1* Current Fuel Pressure*
8 114-4 N75 Duty Cycle
9 115-3 Boost Pressure (Specified)
10 115-4 Boost Pressure (Actual)
11 230-1 Rail Pressure - Specified
12 230-2 Rail Pressure - Actual

ROUND 2 LOGGING:
Use for Boost and Timing
Diagnosis
Item # Vag-Com
Block # Description
1 001-1 Engine Speed
2 003-4 ignition Timing
3 020-1 Cylinder Ignition Angle Delay (cyl 1)
4 020-2 Cylinder Ignition Angle Delay (cyl 2)
5 020-3 Cylinder Ignition Angle Delay (cyl 3)
6 020-4 Cylinder Ignition Angle Delay (cyl 4)
7 031-1 Lambda, Current Value
8 054-3 Accelerator Pedal Position
9 101-3 Injection Timing (Median)
10 114-3 Engine Load (actual)
11 115-4 Boost Pressure (Actual)
12 230-2 Rail Pressure - Actual

ROUND 3 LOGGING:
MAF/Load-Specific Diagnosis
Item # Vag-Com
Block # Description
*Not Applicable to EA888 TSI/TFSI Engines.
1 001-1 Engine Speed
2 003-2 Intake Air Mass
3 031-1 Lambda, Current Value
4 054-3 Accelerator Pedal Position
5 054-4 Throttle Plate Angle
6 101-3 Injection Timing (Median)
7* 103-1* Current Fuel Pressure*
8 114-1 Engine Load (specified)
9 114-3 Engine Load (actual)
10 115-3 Boost Pressure (Specified)
11 115-4 Boost Pressure (Actual)
12 230-2 Rail Pressure - Actual

ROUND 4 LOGGING:
Misfire-Specific Diagnosis
Item # Vag-Com
Block # Description
1 001-1 Engine Speed
2 003-2 Intake Air Mass
3 015-1 Misfire Cyl 1
4 015-2 Misfire Cyl 2
5 015-3 Misfire Cyl 3
6 016-1 Misfire Cyl 4
7 054-3 Accelerator Pedal Position
8 054-4 Throttle Plate Angle
9 101-3 Injection Timing (Median)
10 115-3 Boost Pressure (Specified)
11 115-4 Boost Pressure (Actual)
12 230-2 Rail Pressure - Actual

ROUND 5 LOGGING:
Use for Boost and Timing
Item # Vag-Com
Block # Description
1 003-1 Engine Speed
2 003-2 Intake Air Mass
3 003-3 Throttle Angle
3 003-4 Ignition Timing
4 020-1 Cylinder Ignition Angle Delay (cyl 1)
5 020-2 Cylinder Ignition Angle Delay (cyl 2)
6 020-3 Cylinder Ignition Angle Delay (cyl 3)
7 020-4 Cylinder Ignition Angle Delay (cyl 4)
8 031-1 Lambda, Current Value
10 114-4 N75 Duty Cycle
11 115-3 Boost Pressure (Specified)
12 115-4 Boost Pressure (Actual)


I tried MElogger with no success.
I will try again tomorrow.

The symptoms are:
Engine performance hesitation/oscillation of output.
When pressing throttle about 1/3 the output is oscillating.
When pressing more than 1/3 throttle the output is less and the oscillating is greater.
Thing are worse at 4th, 5th and 6th gears.
0-100 comes in almost 12 secs.
What I saw from logging is that the above occurs when pressure goes above 1bar.
With stock injectors the injection timing was from 20 to 38ms while LTFT were +-5%, now with 380cc timing is up to 19ms but LTFT are -20% and rising.



I hope I could describe the feeling.

Thanks again
Alex

PS REVO also installed LPG in my car.
In LPG the performance is less but the symptoms remain.
Also I found they used the pressure pipe in air intake to make a junction and feed LPG MAP and LPG Vaporiser with pressure info. I told them to repair as the same line feds DV valve control via N24o