NefMoto

Technical => Tuning => Topic started by: fat_chris on March 22, 2018, 01:28:21 PM



Title: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: fat_chris on March 22, 2018, 01:28:21 PM
So i'm new to this tuning. I'm using a 03 BDF VR6 ECU on a 3.2 VR6 in a 97 golf.
ECU part number : 022 906 032 DM
The ecu has some prior "stage 1" file from an unknown source.
I've flashed the 95040 to off

I've successfully pulled the bin file from the ecu and opened it in tuner pro and now i'm lost. I found a XDF file for a similar part number but haven't a clue what to do next.

Due to the nature of my swap I also need the SAI/Rear O2 and the evap and catalyst monitors turned off.

As far as the "swap" part of the file i believe all it does is some how disable the need for a VSS to the ecu since it won't be present with my swap.

I want to learn whats involved with this, not looking for someone to do it for me but maybe help me in the right direction????

Thanks in advance!!!



Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: fat_chris on March 28, 2018, 10:16:45 AM
anyone?


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: mister t on March 29, 2018, 03:09:52 PM
Depends largely on what hardware modifications you've done to the engine.

If it's stock you can make some minimal gains, bump the timing a few degrees, eliminate throttle delays, remap torque tables for better response and change the AFR requests as well as delays re: driver request for enrichment.

You can also tweak the cam timing maps to keep the lobe angles separate at low loads/cruise instead of the factory default EGR settings. I found it improved transient response.

If you've eliminated the cats and installed a good flowing exhaust as well as intake, then you can add more timing as the gas exchange processes are better (i.e. less residual exhaust gas heating the chamber).

As well, cam timing becomes much more crucial as you've changed the volumeteric efficiency of the engine and need to find where your cam timing makes the best power. Your best way is to set the cam angle to a constant amount and log MAF readings through a series of WOT sweeps. From there, look at what angles make best power and adjust accordingly.


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: prj on March 29, 2018, 03:26:10 PM
Setting cam timing per MAF is stupid in an engine that has overlap.

If your car is stock, flash stock file, and most likely you will have more power than with the so-called remap on stock NA car.


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: mister t on March 29, 2018, 04:31:26 PM
Setting cam timing per MAF is stupid in an engine that has overlap.

If your car is stock, flash stock file, and most likely you will have more power than with the so-called remap on stock NA car.

What are you smoking lol?  While you may get some 'noise' due to reversion, it doesn't mean that your MAF readings aren't a valid metric. Besides, you can get a cleaned up signal by logging _ml, problem solved.

Also, while you get increased pumping efficiency by introducing overlap with the exhaust cam in low load areas or low RPM operating areas, you don't make as much torque as you would with separated lobe angles.

Cam phasers are also subject to delay when you tip in to higher load areas. This results in less than optimal torque during tip in when you move from overlap (EGR) to separated lobe angles (peak torque) end of story. I've tested it on my own 3.0 AVK and it made a substantial difference to throttle response.

Look just accept the fact that I MAY know a few things about N/A engine tuning that you may not and move on...

You can't win 'em all man.


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: prj on March 30, 2018, 01:23:56 AM
What are you smoking lol?  While you may get some 'noise' due to reversion, it doesn't mean that your MAF readings aren't a valid metric. Besides, you can get a cleaned up signal by logging _ml, problem solved.

Also, while you get increased pumping efficiency by introducing overlap with the exhaust cam in low load areas or low RPM operating areas, you don't make as much torque as you would with separated lobe angles.

Cam phasers are also subject to delay when you tip in to higher load areas. This results in less than optimal torque during tip in when you move from overlap (EGR) to separated lobe angles (peak torque) end of story. I've tested it on my own 3.0 AVK and it made a substantial difference to throttle response.

Look just accept the fact that I MAY know a few things about N/A engine tuning that you may not and move on...

You can't win 'em all man.

Yawn.
MAF reading != power on anything that has overlap.
If you had a dyno, you'd know. I'm sure I'll be greeted with another useless wall of text tho :D

I also think there is nothing to "accept" because you don't know jack shit about ICE's, you just think you do ;)


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: _nameless on March 30, 2018, 06:20:55 AM
anyone?
i had a few min so i located eskonf, prokon and errorclass cla. i didnt spend too much time so error s could exist but youll be in the neighborhood


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: _nameless on March 30, 2018, 06:25:28 AM
csv


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: fat_chris on March 30, 2018, 08:14:35 AM
Depends largely on what hardware modifications you've done to the engine.

The car no longer has SAI or an EVAP system, catalyst is gone also. Porsche Cayenne intake manifold and heavily ported touareg exhaust manifolds.
I'd like to disable the monitors so i don't have codes for the missing items.


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: prj on March 30, 2018, 10:22:57 AM
EVAP -> CDTES
SAI -> CDSLS

And if you unplugged solenoids, you will have to change the endstage configuration as well (ESKONF).


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: mister t on March 30, 2018, 01:28:26 PM
Yawn.
MAF reading != power on anything that has overlap.
If you had a dyno, you'd know. I'm sure I'll be greeted with another useless wall of text tho :D

I also think there is nothing to "accept" because you don't know jack shit about ICE's, you just think you do ;)

*thpbbbb* Fart  ;)

You know as well as I know that owning a dyno does not open up the secrets of the universe.

Much like yourself, I REALLY don't care what you 'think' I know.

Thousands of hours (and yes, I mean that VERY literally) of careful observation of cause and effect means I've learned a thing or two about tuning naturally aspirated engines.

Anyway, you can choose to listen to me or not, It's seriously no skin off my ass.


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: mister t on March 30, 2018, 01:38:39 PM
And FWIW prj, while you may be a cranky asshole, so am I, so you're starting to grow on me lol.

At least you have good arguments, better than dealing with the Kool-Aid brigade on Audizine.....  ::) ::) ::)


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: mister t on March 30, 2018, 01:50:18 PM
OP, here's a fully defined version of a 022 906 032 CB you should be able to line it up with your ori in winOLS and make a pretty full definition file.


Title: Re: BDF 7.1.1 Tuning
Post by: prj on March 30, 2018, 02:23:41 PM
You know as well as I know that owning a dyno does not open up the secrets of the universe.
No, it doesn't. But it's the easiest way to demonstrate that MAF readings mean nothing when tuning cam timing, without having to write a wall of text about dynamic compression ratio, which I have no time for.
Simply put, if you set the cam timing per MAF readings you will be way off target for best torque.