NefMoto

Technical => Tuning => Topic started by: Kompiesto on October 05, 2018, 11:23:01 AM



Title: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on October 05, 2018, 11:23:01 AM
Hi,

I tune car for my friend and I stuck.
Setup is: 1.8t AUM ME7.5 (06A906032HJ), K03s hybrid (mazda compressor wheel), MBC,  440cc 0280155968, stock 3 bar FPR, stock fuel pump, Big IC, forge hybrid dv.
Boost is ok... he choose MBC i did not argue, i tune it for MBC.
Problem is with fuel setting. First he had china 440cc and was a pain to tune it... Fueling was not bad and i created 238hp on 1bar boost.

After few days he "rebulid" engine for more power (changed some parts to new) and changed injectors for new original because old injectors very fast dead. Now i have problem to setup this properly. I used TVUB from injector spec : 2.098, 1.32, 0.9173, 0.6693, 0.4987 and calculated KRKTE : 0.07237. The problem is on high load. When i have crusing and idling all was very good, very small trims but on boost i have very rich lambda 0.75 and throttle cut. I tryied repair this by fkkvs table but scalar is 0.66-0.57... is to big correction i think. Still have rich spikes and problem with final power, only 200-205hp (checked on dyno).

In monday i want check air leaks, install normal dv, install fuel pressure gauge. I suspect fuel pump but...  AFR should be lean, not rich if pump pressure is too small (?).

Thanks for tips

Martin


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: AngelPowy on October 05, 2018, 04:10:05 PM
If fuel pump was your problem you will have a lean spot and not a rich one. Does all your lambda target maps tuned to follow your lambda wishes? Did you log stft at low load/ part load to see maybe if the ecu did not apply a LTFT correction maybe? Or maybe as you think you may have a leak somewhere.


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: nyet on October 05, 2018, 04:59:37 PM
Boost leak losing metered air probably


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on October 08, 2018, 11:53:35 PM
I checked system for some air leaks but i dont find anything... I will try change MAF... Anyone had damaged sensor, like me that? Somebody can confirm my TVUB & KRKTE variables?

Regards


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: nyet on October 10, 2018, 01:22:22 PM
post logs


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: littco on October 10, 2018, 03:08:09 PM
Sounds like you have stock bts and it's kicking in and dumping fuel.


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: yxx499 on October 11, 2018, 08:26:44 AM
Without logs we can talk 10 days without any base discuss.


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: _nameless on October 11, 2018, 06:02:16 PM
Without logs we can talk 10 days without any base discuss.
I would use just about any injectors besides 440s. For the price you can get ev14 1000cc injectors for the same price as genuine Bosch 440s. Just saying


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on October 11, 2018, 11:08:38 PM
I heard that 440cc are the worst injectors for tuner to set it properly heh. After searching infos in internet i found that TVUB variables from datasheet are wrong. Some users of custom standalone ecus (megasquirt) had problems with set it properly.

Should be 12V@0.47ms, 14V@0.22ms

Next thing is i have damaged MAF. After logging i saw that MAF should have about 140g/s but had 100g/s on the same file.

Calculated KRKTE is wrong. When i setting KRKTE down and down, i found different scalar, is: 0.059. Is diffrent than was calculated! Now from 3k to 7k, actual lambda following reqest lambda with -6, -7% of trim. Idle and part thottle is bad, is too lean, +20-25% of fuel correction. I think i can correct this by fkkvs fixer. Next thing is warming map.

BTS & LAMFA are modified for the best power.

Somebady have any experience with this injectors and can get some advices? Is my first touch of 440cc injectors.

Today i try upload some logs.

Regards


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: nyet on October 12, 2018, 08:48:50 AM
Idle and part thottle is bad, is too lean, +20-25% of fuel correction. I think i can correct this by fkkvs fixer.

that is WAY too much for fixer. Something else is awry


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on October 21, 2018, 11:25:03 AM
I do not want this car anymore ...
....anyway car still dont want go faster

I think problem with fueling is solved. MAF was changed and some pipe was leak. Another thing was ignition... on top was too much retard and maybe cause lambda rich... anyway now i use 0.0745 KRKTE and stock latency from datasheet of injectors.
 
What was done next... i decided to find N75 duty for pressure in intake and tune this turbo for original N75 valve. Installed bigger maf and calibrated.

I maked a lot of logs.... and i think engine must be in bad condition. Engine have 173983 miles and have LPG installation.
I thinking that maybe timing belt, gears are in wrong position. In VCDS, 93 channel have -7 CF... is ok? Some people said that should be 0 or higher not less.

This car is strange... i logged some data today and i have:
- nice fueling fr_w only +5% on WOT
- lambda 0.87 to 0.79 max on top rpm
- rlmax is 177%
- actual rl_w get only 150
- mlhfm only 142 g/s
- ignition retard only -6
- knock voltages at 6k like 18-20V
- turbo generate 1.4bar to 1.1bar at top.
- temp outside was 10C

Ecu is not scaled down. Only axis changes.

I forgot log rlsol but i rescaled MIOP, MIRL, WOP, WOP2 maps for more load.

No torque intervention, car runs smooth, no jerks or something.... maybe a forgot something :(


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: nyet on October 21, 2018, 05:13:16 PM
post logs

Without logs we can talk 10 days without any base discuss.

I maked a lot of logs.

......


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on October 21, 2018, 09:47:08 PM
Sorry nyet :P

Please look on nmot & wped because i not log only one pull in WOT but all my riding

Timing jumping...  air/load drop down after 3900rpm, lambda not stable is maybe because timing oscillate up and down... timing should be ok... is bumped a bit on lower load & rpms and go down a bit at top... added last column with lowered timing at 185 rl.

Thanks for some advices


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: nyet on October 22, 2018, 10:23:33 AM
log tabgbts, lambts and lamfawkr

https://s4wiki.com/wiki/Tuning#LAMBTS

Might also want to log req boost.


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on October 23, 2018, 10:34:56 AM
Today i tried do some logs but weather is very bad and car is not have quattro system... I fighting with weather and traction on route and audi...

From log now i can say that something is not ok with current lambda. On chart you can see lean spike when turbo spooling... this can cause cut of power...

I attached my TVUB & KRKTE... idle are perfect. The problem is too small krkte? Pump/FPR is bad?

Better is do fueling using BTS table and switch off LAMFA or not?


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: nyet on October 23, 2018, 05:50:48 PM
Something is not right, maybe BPV is leaking? something is happening mid spool, that load drop is odd.

Leave requested fuel alone until you work out that load issue.


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: nyet on October 23, 2018, 05:55:05 PM
ps_w is diverging a LOT..

Has to be a BIG vac leak, between MAF and turbo inlet.

check your turbo inlets


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on October 23, 2018, 11:07:48 PM
I cant find any leaks  :-\. Maybe N249 faulty or some check valve. I changed DV to original but no visible difference of driveability.
Maybe for tests modify file to mafless? 


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: nyet on October 24, 2018, 10:06:17 AM
I cant find any leaks  :-\. Maybe N249 faulty or some check valve. I changed DV to original but no visible difference of driveability.
Maybe for tests modify file to mafless?  

No, mafless is never a good idea for just about anything, least of all tracking down problems.

Is your KFKHFM stock?


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on October 24, 2018, 11:25:14 AM
Yes, KFKHFM is stock.

In the past i had load cut problems but load actual go higher than reqested... in this case rl does not even touch reqested :/


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: nyet on October 24, 2018, 01:04:23 PM
Either you are losing a ton of unmetered air or your MAF is bad.


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on October 24, 2018, 10:58:49 PM
Yes, i thinking like You nyet but i dont see/hear any leaks. Maybe some pipe is air leaking when pressure is high... i dont have more time to investigate this topic... i must send car to mechanic and let him look at this... maybe he find something what is wrong. For now thank you nyet for your help... if it will change sometching in topic i will write post.



Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: bororobbo on October 28, 2018, 03:49:47 AM
Ditch the hybrid DV they leak no matter what, use oem diverted valve or forge 008p.


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: Kompiesto on November 24, 2019, 06:29:10 AM
Cause: leaky intercooler on higher pressure :'(


Title: Re: 440cc 0280155968 1.8t - too rich at boost
Post by: aef on November 26, 2019, 03:39:16 AM
at least you found it  ;D