Print Page - Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs

Title: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 08, 2019, 11:35:57 AM

My BEX(8E0909518AH) have a really strange PID control. It works really well on stock tune (it boost only 0.6 bar tru all RPM range)
But as soon i lift a boost it is hard to control turbo.
Stock file,only I lifted LDRXN
(https://i.postimg.cc/zVWS4m8j/stock-tuned.png) (https://postimg.cc/zVWS4m8j)
when I look at stock maps, I don't know where to start
(https://i.postimg.cc/pdJKjJTp/maps.png) (https://postimg.cc/SXjXF8ch)

Sooo, schould I try to fix this maps, or to copy values from older ECU. And do i need to define more maps for PID control

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: nyet on October 08, 2019, 11:41:39 AM

Post the rest of your logs. Pull IMX so there isn't so much overshoot.

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: fknbrkn on October 08, 2019, 11:46:26 AM

Stock dimx capped to 64% @mid range with last 1000mbar axe

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 08, 2019, 12:10:49 PM

Logs from first post are with original turbo, but Yes i tried to pull down imx, didn't make any differnce.
Problem is, that this ECU use KFLDRL as some sort of gain map( look at low values input is 20% Dc output is 50% DC and so on)

This is with other turbo, standard k03-029
(https://i.postimg.cc/vT8FrVnQ/k03-standard.png) (https://postimg.cc/r0HPczgb)

(https://i.postimg.cc/T3f7p6r6/imx-mod.png) (https://postimages.org/)

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: nyet on October 08, 2019, 01:55:07 PM

How can you possibly know what is going on w/o logging the PID variables?

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 08, 2019, 11:00:21 PM

Quote from: nyet on October 08, 2019, 01:55:07 PM

How can you possibly know what is going on w/o logging the PID variables?

I don't have RAM location of these :-\

Code:

;ldimn_w          ;{BoostPID-I-Min}                   ; {Aktueller Wert zur Minimalwertbegrenzung I-Anteil LDR}
;ldimx_w          ;{BoostPID-I-Max}                   ; {Aktueller Wert zur Maximalwertbegrenzung I-Anteil LDR}
;ldimxa_0         ;{BoostCorrectFactorPID-IRange1}    ; {Adaptive Korrektur der LDR I-Regler Maximalwertbegrenzung}
;ldimxa_1         ;{BoostCorrectFactorPID-IRange2}    ; {Adaptive Korrektur der LDR I-Regler Maximalwertbegrenzung}
;ldimxa_2         ;{BoostCorrectFactorPID-IRange3}    ; {Adaptive Korrektur der LDR I-Regler Maximalwertbegrenzung}
;ldimxa_3         ;{BoostCorrectFactorPID-IRange4}    ; {Adaptive Korrektur der LDR I-Regler Maximalwertbegrenzung}
;ldimxa_4         ;{BoostCorrectFactorPID-IRange5}    ; {Adaptive Korrektur der LDR I-Regler Maximalwertbegrenzung}
;ldimxak_w        ;{ChargeLimitPID-I}                 ; {Aktueller korrigierter Begrenzungswert I-Anteil LDR}

only this if could help

Some of my play with IMX and KFLDRL to see how will behavier

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: soul87 on October 10, 2019, 12:52:51 AM

start of boost looks ok now, no overboost.

Raise IMX for higher RPM, because it back to dynamic mode when Ide > UMDYLDR

BEX PIDs are crazy ;) they are designed for K03s (k03-073) only and for lower boost.

BFB pids works better.

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 10, 2019, 02:16:44 AM

Yes it is okay for now till 5-6 gear,as soon it get close to req boost it tapers down WGDC really strong... but I am going to copy PID values from some other ECU BFB or AWT. Becuse fixing this will take too much time. And maybe there is some hardware issue, it looks like turbo is too sensitive on DC change
(https://i.postimg.cc/g0s24zMZ/6-gear-pull.png) (https://postimg.cc/9442QhHm)

And it make a same boost at high rpm-s when i discconect WG hose. As it makes when everthing is conncect and WG is operating at 70%
(https://i.postimg.cc/9F4HzGsS/prvi-testko3-20191008-151232-vs-prvi-testko3-20191009-143729.png) (https://postimg.cc/qzd55CJX)forensic anthropology salary uk (https://forensicanthropologist.net/salary)

And this is boost when WGDC is 0%, soo i consider that WG perload is good
(https://i.postimg.cc/y6kbT7n3/no-WG-electrical.png) (https://postimg.cc/XX6LjSRn)

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: soul87 on October 10, 2019, 03:42:06 AM

Copy PIDs IMX and LDR map from BFB, not AWT and tune IMX . I have ram PID variables for BEX ecu If You want to fine TUNE IMX but I can share it at today evening

BEX LDR map is hard to tune cause it raise 80-85% I limit to 95%.

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 10, 2019, 05:50:19 AM

If you have RAM locations that would be great. As well as PID maps locations, beacuse I am not sure are my good

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: nyet on October 10, 2019, 12:57:33 PM

still oscillating even though IMX is low, issue now is tuning Q0, Q0S and Q2 :(

Its not easy... even if you numb DRL response (slope) you may still have ringing, or even make it worse.

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: soul87 on October 11, 2019, 12:58:27 AM

imho its osciliting because IMX is too low... boost drops below requested and after few sec IMX adaptation try to raise boost?

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 11, 2019, 01:59:50 AM

BTW i loose I little bit a WG acuator it looks like it was too stif. Going to take some logs
edit:
YES actuator was to stiff, now the boost looks more realistic acording to DC
But I am not clear why does not PID raise DC when actual boost is below desired?

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 11, 2019, 01:49:06 PM

Ok i think I did it. It is really close to perfect. Car puls realy linear and so great. I am really satisfact
Need a little more play with numbers for fine tuning, but for now is great

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: prj on October 11, 2019, 11:32:21 PM

Sorry but this looks horrible.

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 11, 2019, 11:42:57 PM

Can you explain why?

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: fknbrkn on October 12, 2019, 07:46:12 AM

You solve 1 specific problem (@wot on a third gear in mid range rpm) by the hard limiting of kfldrl
Thus works only with these conditions
And linear drl goes pretty well on a big turbos with ext wg but not in this case

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 12, 2019, 11:29:23 AM

Not true, it work realy well so far. No mather what gear, what RPM and how much throotle. Real real smooth and responsive boost in every area

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: prj on October 12, 2019, 12:07:03 PM

You might as well run it off of LDRAPP.
It's pretty much open loop at this point.

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 12, 2019, 12:48:51 PM

I want to do it right way. No cheat, even if it is working right. I will do some more research about ME7 PID. Then try to tune it again

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: soul87 on October 12, 2019, 09:51:11 PM

Imx and ldr maps looks strange... You want 95 dc n75 everytime at spool... Also maps should be somehow smooth and linear... You are setting 95dc at spool for 1000mbar and 80dc at 1300... Ldr map Also is not linear... Bad idea

Title: Re: Tuning PID on 8E0 ECUs
Post by: BlackT on October 13, 2019, 05:38:49 AM

Quote from: soul87 on October 12, 2019, 09:51:11 PM

I didn't bordet with that region beacuse in low RPM turbo can't open WG, so i the same what DC is it

Yes, but with this seting on actuator i have huge spike on 95% DC . It must be limited whey before the turbo get close to desired boost. 80% or 95% when this little turbo spool up, the diffrence in spool speed is insignificant. And I like more this linear spool at little lower DC, the car is nicer to drive

But I will try with RS4 values for IMX and LDR to see what will hapen

NefMoto

Technical => Tuning => Topic started by: BlackT on October 08, 2019, 11:35:57 AM