NefMoto

Hi, I have been rebuilding my Vr6 3.2 BUB for some time now.. 

Everything was ready to start up couple of days ago. So I threw in a battery and tried to start.. Bang!!.. That battery was inverted.. Positive side was (-) and Ground was (+).. So i blew the main fuses in the fusebox under the bonnet and the stereo went out..  I changed the fuses and a new battery. Started the car and it was running for about an hour.  And I got the error code (Camshaft not correlated to crankshaft).. The cams were two cogs away from the marks...  So I took it apart and adjusted the upper timing chain..  Then i started and it ran for 1 min.. I shut it off to top up some coolant.. Then the engine was totally dead.

I did following checks:

Fueldelivery: OK
Spark: NO Spark
RPM signal: OK
Battery: New
Fuel: NEW
12V to coils: OK
Groundings to Coils: OK (But there was a grounding cable in the harnes that was abit uncertain if it was tightened)

So it came down to no Spark.. I used the multimeter to check harness to ECU and that was intact. But then i ran a test on one if the camshaft HALL sensor connectors. The connector is 3-pol. (Pin1 Ground, Pin2 Signal, Pin3 5v).
It measured 12V on the signal pin.. hmm thats wierd..  So I disconnected ECU harness and 12V dissapeared on the S pin.

This leads me to ECU problems. I have a new ECU on its way but.. im wondering if its possible to repair this ECU somehow?

What do you guys think?

check this.
http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=17503.0title=

error during posting.. sorry

Thanks ! Exactly what i was looking for.

Seems more like the ECU was not the problem.. Hooked up a new ECU after swapping the immo chip over to it..  Same behavior and no spark.. Then i changed the immo chip back to my old ECU and i got no connection even to the ECU or the cluster via VCDS... Waited a few hours and disconnected the battery för 20min..and put the +- togheter and the ECU woke up again.. but with same issue as before (no spark)..
Then i tried som diffrent methods with VCDS to enter my WSC code to recode the key and try and se if that was the problem. But didnt manage to understand how to do that so I decided to disconnect battery another 20 min.. 

Then after connecting the battery again..  contact with ECU was lost again and the cooling fans started to run after 30sec´s..  Like if the ECU was totally dead. And no contact with anything on VCDS..

I have now checked all the relays 2 times.. and all the fuses 2 times... both under the bonnet and at the power supply board in the car. Als all the main fuses.  I have never come across a problem like this in my life..

Im totally out of ideas..   It feels like the CAN-bus have gotten it self a smack.. But i dont kow where to start now.

Can you upload your actual eeprom here please?
I would like to check.

Yes i Can do that. You mean immo chip?

Yes immo eeprom

Heres what i read out 2 days ago with my Miniprogrammer.

Eeprom is ok, not locked.
Hmm...

Have you tried immo off?
If than car start I think dash will be problem.

Yes im starting to think about trying immo off.. Where can i get a immo off for this ECU?   Can the immo make the CAN bus of comms go down..

try this Eeprom.
After you can check on table with vcds if it is immo off. -> see picture inside archieve.

i have hade one time same problem with a TT 1.8T, there was not possile to reach engine ecu via obd with vcds.
After immo off it was possible.

good luck

Thanks so much man im gonna try this asap.. all ideas are welcome.. ;D

I try to help.
It is important that you hear fast the nice sound of your engine.  ;D

That immo off gave me acces to VSDC now i atleast have response.. Thanks man appriciate it.  VCDS reaches most of the controlles but the ECU is totally dead..  I measured on the T121 connector pin 3 on the ECU but no powersupply at all.. I should measure 12V+ when key is turned..  I need to trace that supply to se where it goes.. Maybe that will lead me to what caused all this mess :)

Its now almost 3 years since i drove this car after the engine broke down.. Finally rebuilt it and now this. Thats car life :)

I tried to follow the 12V+ Supply and measure on any fuse that relates to the ECU connector (pin 3) non had contact with the Pin 3 powersupply to ECU.. (noo beep)..  But then i measured on the fuse holder to anti-theft unit it pinged with Pin 3 but only for 2 seconds the something turned it off.. I then put back the fuse to anti theft unit and took it out again.. did the same as befor and pinged with the multimeter to the ECU connector power supply and it again beeped for 2 seconds..   hmmm...  it makes sens if the ECU power supply goes throug the anti-theft unit but.. that dont make sens with the drawing posted.  Gotta check again.

Maybe the TT mk2 have bit diffrent power supply to the ECU than the R32.

Today evening i will look if I can find some better drawing.

I was back in my garage today and the progress so far is this:

I did a boot mode flash with MPPS 13.. I loaded my file that i have had with working engine..  I connected my ECU and the problem was gone for a few seconds.. I could hear the E-Throttle come to life and the fuel pump primed... Then i left the key in the car for a while just in case.  Turned the ign 10min later.. And the ECU was lost again..   

Did the same procedure again..  Boot flashed software.. connected ECU.. And again i could hear the fuelpump and the E-gas.. But this time only for 2 seconds or something. Then the fans started to turn.
The fans start as a failsafe mode if no coolant temp is active i have heard.. or the ECU is gone..    I can still communicate with most Modules in VCDS but not the ECU..  Well the ECU responds but not completly.. its not possible to read any measblocks or fault codes..  and no VAG number shows in the dialog..

Than Flash ori software.
Are you sure your checksum is ok?

I know if checksum is bad at this can ecu you can only Start engine one time.
Or if writing not finished error. -> vcds fault code

Use with Mpps full write.

After first flashing check fault codes on ecu

 You have a point there.. maybe some thing with the checksum is bad..  Im currently use mpps in flashmode: Me7.x.x 1Mb eprom.  Not sure what full MPPS write is.. it was many years now since i did this..
And i think i use to make checksum with ECM titanium..  MPPS cant do scheksums here..   I can also use my KESS if thats better

yes try kess v2.
also look tru protokoll list if there are different families.


here are your drawings, i hope.
http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=17529.msg134357#msg134357

ahh thanks man.. I did a checksum correction on the file with ECM titanium.. And flashed the ECU..  Same this time aswell... Turned the ignition and exactly after 2 seconds ECU dies and fans comes on ...

Im right now thinking about wire the ECU directly to the 12V..  But first im gonna check those drawings u posted. :)

Im almost now sure the immo file is corrupt or something..    Followed the 12V+ and its in order.. Thanks to the new drawings posted. ECU get 12V on pin3 so that route is now checked..

So here i am.. ECU lives 2 seconds after reflash then fans starts.. Cluster issue?  Crash Mode? Power module?   im clueless..

If fan's starts - ecu not response. If Ecu immo locked - fans should be off and You can connect to ecu by vcds and You should saw immo error in dtc's. Try connect ecu on table. If ecu works normal on table You have something wrong in harness. I think ecu could be damaged. You must check ecu power lines inside - if ecu dead after 2 sec on table. Check resistance between +12V and GND in ecu. Ecu takes about 0,5A.

I have good 032HJ ecu with 032gp software.

Thanks for that..  yes.. I always get contact with my ECUs even if immo is damaged..  But when fans starts it gives me the feeling that something is shorted to ground. I can hook up the ECU on the bech and se if it lives with VCDS there.. Do i need access to CAN bus pins when doing this or does VCDS use K-Line.. My test harness needs to be updated in that case hm...  And Is there need for ignition pin to get it to respond on this ECU or just power..

I´ll give it a try.

I can connect to the ECU on the board same as in the car but i cant read any faulst due to com error.. that might be the CAN bus..

You can read dtc only by can bus pins, vcds or elm327 works. You write stock file in boot? Checksums ok? MPPS13 not calculate checksum

Yes i wrote stock file in boot.. I use to wrie with kess.. but since i dont get contact with ECU i write in boot.. the stock file should work i think.. i did checksum with ECM titanium.

I get contact but cant read DTC´s  or Measblocks..  I only see ECU numbers :(
I have two ECU´s  same with both.

Here is my stock file and immo.. If someone could check them.

Try do full reflash eep+mpc+flash. If You se only numbers, software is damaged. I look on Yours immo file when i will be after work.

 Ok...  I have and MPPS13 and a Kess v2.. thats it..  I have managed to get it into bott mode and flashed it..    Not familiar with eep and mpc..   youmean eeprom and main program?

I´ll give it a try..  this is so damn typical.. Gonna start the car after 2 years.. then this shite...  im seriously considering going "Ignitron"..

The fastest way will be change ecu to find what damaged :(

Why would you do checksum on a stock file?
99% this is your problem.

If you truly have a full stock read, then write it as-is without fucking with it.

It's his st10 turbo file. Old mpps tend not to work on st10's, mcp/mcu data needed for load mods, which I think he did, would need the tool to flash over the data and with the st10 traps/timeouts/resets (been a while since I read c167 stuff and am no pro coder), plus the data to be retained on the mcu, then I'm thinking this could be why.
 Or it could defo be hardware or CS prob, those are the 3 likely answers and even if it is one of the latter 2, you still need to be mindful of the tools/data transfer on doing fi files on these regardless of what you do in the flash.

prj i have tried with stock file already.. I have 2 ECUs i have tesed this. on. Im gonna go try more flashing tomorrow. If 2 ECUs are coocked im done.. Going to film some tomorrow..

Some progress now..  I took the ECU to the bench again and flashed  it with KESS V2 in "Recovery mode".. Thats the only mode that works. I flashed it with my stock file. Installed ECU in the car and now the fans dont start and the E-gas is calibrating.

In VCDS i can now read more numbers from the info screen.  I can also read Meas blocks and so on.. But can get accsess to faultcodes.. it says DTC´s nott supported or no contact...   But the big thing is that it fired up and died imediataley now. Then ECU locked it self and the fans came on.. 

Getting close and closer it feels.. Immo issue? I have my stock immo in the M95160 eeprom now.. Maybe i should go back to that immo off file again and try out that..  Any ideas on why it behaves like this.

I have post the immo off eeprom.
Also there is a picture where to check with vcds if immo is really off...
Check on table if immo is off.

If immo is off on table you can disconnect dash and than try start engine with immo off ecu.
Check if than fan still comes on.

With kess if you write in recovery, write ori file.
In recovery mode there will be no checksum done , this Is what we want with ori file.

Cant re-produce the process with "Recovery" more...  Getting wake up error all the time...  I think it might be the tool thats messing with me..

After having the ECU out of the car for 2 hours I was able to repcoduce the state where it fired up and died insantly. Before i cranked the engine i took a look in the ECU in VCDS and its possible to read "measblocks" now.. huh..

Also checked Immobilizer and I had premission to start and so on.. But i noticed that I lost the connection to this unit after a few seconds. it behaved strange.   Also that channel 91 that i should read cant be done due to non licenced VCDS tool.. soo :(     arrghh

Could someone help me with immo off on this file..  I want to be 100% sure i didnt mix the file i posted with this.. i found this on my old car computer.. This is a read out i did. couple of years ago. and this should be the correct immo from the car before i started tuning it...

here your eeprom.

can you please also upload your ori flash? i want to check something.

thanks

br

Yes here it is..

Ok som new info i got..  I recived an ECU from a friend with a 3.2 from 2004.. its the slightly older ECU..  I just wanted to test with that ECU.. And funny thing is that the ECU fires upp all time with no fans on.. it like its alive.. But the immo will not allow this ECU to start with my BUB...  Its the SP08c3 eeprom on this ECU.. 

Just for the fun of it I soldered a M95160W eeprom from my other ECU on to this ECU and ended up in the same "locked dead fan" state with this ECU aswell...  The ECUs acts as if the chip is dead or damaged..   

I once had another old BUB ECU from 3years ago and that had som damaged eeprom pads.. And that ECU acted in this way aswell... as if there was no eeprom in place..  I have also checked that i soldered the eeprom in the correct way with gnd in right place and so on..

Im going to do a test now to flash the immo from M95 to SP08 chip.. i doubt it will work but just a test..

Checksum is wrong, has been wrong the entire time.
Soldering DIFFERENT chips from different ECUs to each other? Yeah great idea.

Just get a standalone, this is not for you.

"This is not for you"  Well that was encurraging words...  As usual from you..  Been on this forum for 8 many years now. And getting used to hear same helping words coming from you :)  PRJ.   Im doing my best to try to understand.

Soldering chips from diffrent ECU has worked before on this ECU.. The R32 ECU i have now in my TT has worked for 3 years and has a chip from the original ECU. And i have been burning eeprom back and forth on my ecu´s before without any issues...   I have bench flashed both my ECUs and immo eeprom now to original from the read outs before i even started tuning this car and still wont work.  There is more to my problem than just than immo.

And yes you are totaly right.. I have now bought an Ignitron ECU. It´s on its way. I now have 2 BUB ECU´s  for sale :)   Feels like a big relief to just say good buy to the stock ECU´s   I did learn alot from this.. it wa actually really fun. But im throwing in the towel for now..

Did my best with the time i hade to spend on this.. Learned alot and did not pay single penny to any tuner..

But wait ther is more... I will stay in the forum for some DSG stuff.. So se you around PRJ..

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=17171.msg133139#msg133139

Thanks RBPE, will check it out..

I dont know what You done, i see how You are lost.

ST10 ECU use 95160 and You cant change to different eeprom without architecture compare.

Older ecu with immo off should start.

The best for writing st10 in boot is MPPS V13 in my opinion.

If You install Ignitron ecu You must prepare correct CAN bus messages for proper working of dash, dsg, abs. Canbus frames are described in FR.