NefMoto

Hello,

i search for the address of the Map of the PID-Regulator (on the constant Value) of the Wasegate. Does something exist? Or how can i set it? I drive Audi 200 20V and the Regulator oscilates...

Thanks!
Karel5000

this may help

http://www.nefariousmotorsports.com/wiki/index.php/LDRPID_25.10_%28Charge_Pressure_Regulation_PID_Control%29

Thanks. It seems to be a regulation of a turbocharger of a newer Bosch system. Nevertheless very interesting...

It doesn't oscillate for the reason you think it does.
This ECU does not have classical PID, it's PI with self-learning P.

Some ECM only shows this after some mileage. So it's important to understand the type of regulator :)

If i drive the 300kPa quick pressure sensor from Ultimot, the regulator seems to be oscillating in the part load (0,5-1bar relativ). If i use the 250kPa slower pressure sensor from Bosch, i have no problems. Also it must be someting with the regulation. How can i fix it?

Thanks,
Karel5000

Quick pressure? Slow pressure?
What a load of bullshit...

You can fix it by calibrating the boost control correctly in the ECU, and not just fooling it with a bigger sensor.

Example:

In my case it oscillates because of my setup - smaller RS2 Turbocharger and the bigger wagner exhaust manifold. The problem is not, what you type. You can turn with N75 as you want and it will always oscillate...

No, it won't.

And between both sensor you modified the boost table?

If you write 0x0 in the map of N75, the turbo pressure will not increase above the basic pressure ca. 0,4 bar. If you write 0x1 inside, the pressure will accelerate and than oscilate. It is one example of the behaviour of my setup. Also how do you want to tune the map correct? The quicker 300kpa pressure sensor from Ultimot does it, the 250 oder 200kpa one from Bosch not. In every controll system can you make up conditions, which leads to oscilating, especially in the systems with the bigger delay of the regulation...

Yes. With the 300kPa from Ultimot i had written in the map of N75 0x1. It oscillates. With the 250kPa from Bosch you can drive with higher numbers and it seems ok.

Probably in some next days i will measure the voltage of the N75 with my oscilloscop with the 0x01 in the map and post it. Then i will be sure what exactly happen...

Look, you have no idea how this works. Of course it will oscillate if you put 0x1 in there.
It has nothing to do with the sensor being Bosch, Motorola or otherwise.

The MAP is sampled 5 times per cycle and the highest value is picked once per cycle. Which is why what you are saying is completely useless.
If you set the map to 0x01 you essentially are running only P, so it will oscillate like crazy.
There is no "slower" or "quicker" sensor, this is complete bullshit.

Only way you will find out how it works is IDA Pro. All your guesses are completely wrong so far.
I have tuned these cars with 200, 250, 300, 350, 400, 700kpa MAP sensors without any issues. P is adaptive, it learns rate of climb, you rarely need to adjust it.
This control system will only oscillate if you map it wrong, which is what you are doing. And you are not going to be able to map it right unless you can log actual vs requested N75 DC.
The log I posted was with a 400kpa sensor as you can see with zero issues holding 1.7 bar boost.

You can do this either with McMess or like me with a custom protocol implemented in the ECU.
Just buy VEMS or something, you are never going to get this running. I spent more than 3 years on this, and I have a very good understanding of code. I also have no intent whatsoever to spoon feed any information.

So, if P is fully selfadaptive and the map is only I part, so why it does not oscillate, if i write 0x0 inside?

If it is the same if i use 250kpa or 300kpa sensor, why is it significantly different by me?

Have you ever measured the time response of some pressure or some other sensors? It is interesting. For example those from Motorola are also quicker than those from Bosch...

It's not exactly "I part". Writing 0 or 1 in there is calibrating it completely wrong. As to zero or 1... well what happens if you multiply by zero? And what happens if you multiply by 1?

Because you didn't scale all maps right.

Makes no difference at all, due to the way it's sampled, and I told you how it's sampled.

I tried to write higher values into the N75 map and it seems to be better. Thanx for the Typ!

What is the difference between those three N75 maps, please? How shoud i calibrate them, then?

On 3B you have different maps for different altitude IIRC.

What does it mean "IIRC"? -> If i remember correctly?

yes

Thanx for the info. So if i understand correctly, the three N75 maps belong to the three pressure maps. Every pressure map has its own N75 map...

And please, tell me, i have found six ignition maps. Why so many?

Because the ECU can have coding plugs to select different maps.
And actually there are a LOT more than 6 maps to correct for ignition. You just found main maps I think.

Yes, i ment the main maps.

Can you tell me, what those coding plugs are? It is a part of the hardware? Wenn and what are those coding plugs used for?

I'm guessing to allow for different fuel grades throughout the world.

You think, the knock control switches between the ignition maps according to the grades of fuel?

Not only.
There's only two used at a time... Knock control does not really switch maps, it works differently.

Interresting.

End, please, how does the IDA Pro work? It disassembls the software code? How can i get the code, eventually download it from the ECU?

You bin file include the code ;) You have to disassemble this code and then to understand (biggest problem in the beginning).
Most 8051 processors don't have a internal ROM which is used (read out is difficult but possible).

Interresting. Thanx! It means, that in the boost chip is a software for the boost control and in the motor chip the software for the motor control...

For engine eprom yes, boost I'm not sure but I think so (I only know my S4 V8 motronic a little bit :D).

But the knock control and its functions is to be at least inside of the boost chip...

Yes. And basically there are two control units. Beside I have read that they are not communicating between each other, so knock control is used for different stuff than ignition.

Can you tell it little bit detailed? About reading ROM?

In the CPU. RTFM of the CPU.
There is a lot of stuff what helps you.
Including Assembler guide, register layout etc.
Then you "only" have to find which pin from cpu is which "output" (ignition or what ever) OR to understand the code via the knowledge of the maps.
I have still found the VAG-COM routines, but need more time to indentify everything.
In the moment I do the work twice.
A friend has the FR of the RS2 and he gives me small hints when I have detailed questions.
This way also other guys run and I favor this!
Understanding, learning and with some small help you will be able to tune the ECM.