NefMoto

Hey,

so ill begin like this, new here, yeah... and have used both google and nefmoto search to gather as much knowledge and info on topic as i can.
Tho i feel im not really sure enough to actually take action, yet.

So here is what i need / want.
Just bought a used instrument cluster for Audi RS4 (b7)  for my A4 (as my "first" play-around project in vehicle electronics)
Now ive being told that the data from my original one needs to be cloned over to RS4 one, since data ins crypted, its not easy task like plugging in cables :P

I have been reading as much as i can about ECU / immo role in this process but the more i read the more im raising questionmarks.

I do not have VAGCOM nor VCDS access and the price of those are just too much for my wallet.
Tho i read that for example Kline cables would do the trick, is that correct ?
Also i do have FTDI 232RL (which i found out is being used in kline cables that work with ECU, do i need somekind of microcontroller with custom firmware or something to plug
FTDI into OBD2 ? Am using OSX / Linux only so it would be awesome to  make "own" kline cable.

Since  there are still soooo many questions for me to search answers for, im absolutely open to suggestions, links and all kind of inputs.
Please bear with me and my "dumb" questions. am really trying to get hold of the concept here and gather as much knowledge as possible.

I really hope theres someone whos kind enough to act as mentor of some kind ;)

Cheers

Edit: Shoot, just realized ive been searching for wrong keywords here, using Cluster as phrase gave way more results :P

B7 instrument cluster? I am afraid you need expensive equipment to do anything with it. AVDI with proper license should do the trick.

Ohhh :S
wasnt prepared for that at all, been searching on google for topics where others have swapped and seems some have tried but not directly in B7 with B7 items.
Can find few posts about setting B7 IC into B6 or b5.

Have also found (unfort. lost the link) a post where someone did similar thing on b6 i think it was, he was looking for pinout descriptions and also posted later on a way he managed to get all data needed from old cluster into new one. Have no idea how legit that was but def gave some hope

It is a really nice piece tho, was really looking forward for coloured disp.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/BPOzu6t3ie7kdGcFJeTse-Y43oIicG8RwefSJ9j88mI=w1274-h955-no)

An update, took a look at Rosstech site since pretty much Audi forums point to that direction... vagcom & vcds
http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Immobilizer_III_Immobilizer_Swapping_%28Instrument_Cluster%29 (http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Immobilizer_III_Immobilizer_Swapping_%28Instrument_Cluster%29)

Now im not sure if there is any alternatives to VCDS or VAGCOM (surely someone have created something, nowdays everything is hacked cracked)
but it seems rosstech's stuff allows one to swap instrument cluster.

But then theres the question of that PIN, in the cluster...

B7 is somewhat newer than Immo3 - but that still is not a problem. You can swap cluster in B7 but you have to know your cars PIN/SKC and use new (not used) cluster.

How do i find out which immo mine has ?
If i can swap to new (not used) cluster... bear with me if i get the terms wrong, does that mean the new cluster needs to be "virginized from fabric" ?
What would be the difference in those 2, some chip that needs tp be cleared or something ?

Im not so technical on this topic but as coder im not really accepting the fact this cant be done. Not that im blindly believing in what im trying to accomplish, but cause i lack knowledge in the tech when it comes to  cluster to understand the limitations.

As coder ive found it always helps to never give up :P But thats cause coding is a bit different and more "hackable" area than probably physical components i guess.

Immo3 is just too old, Immo4 came years before your B7, so conclusion is simple :)

If you are able to virginize used cluster it behaves like new, so you will be able to use it. And here comes the problem - virgnizing it :) Second problem (which could be quite easily and cheaply solved is to obtain PIN/SKC for your car - if you do not have it, just pay at the dealership for it).

Okay that seems "easy" enough :P I guess theres a catch, there always is :P

got one more question, seems peeps are uploading dumps up here ans so on... since that part is pretty new, how can i get hold om my dumps ?
Any specific tools needed ?

Found this page http://www.audi-crypto-tools.co.nf/index.php (http://www.audi-crypto-tools.co.nf/index.php), no idea how legit it is but thought   i could look around before actually writing anything on my stuff.

If I were you I would check if genuine VAG Tacho supports both your instrument clusters (old/stock one and new) as you should read both of them. VAG Tacho should be cheapest option for you. If not VAG Tacho, check how much you will have to spend on AVDI with proper license. I do not think it would be possible for you to use anything cheaper.

Can you post both instrument clusters part numbers?

Okay, is saturday so ill try to hit local dealer on monday :)


I havent unmounted original cluster yet, can probably do that later today.
but the RS4 cluster is: 8E0920931E
Beyond letter E im not able to see anything cause the sticker is damaged but i think E is last character. Ill get back to you with original cluster.

Also one more question, Any idea if the display from RS4 can be mounted on original cluster that has Red/yellow disp ?
Theoretically i already see thats problably not possible cause controllers, but you never know :P

I have never opened B6/B7 clusters so could not tell you if you can swap LCD with colour version.

The only letter past E could be X meaning this cluster had been refurbished by factory.

BTW. My ETKA tells me it is not RS4 cluster. It is just regular petrol cluster with speed scale up to 280km/h, which had been superseded by 8E0 920 931 Q and then by 8E0 920 933 E. S4 cluster current part number (for cars up to VIN ending in 180 000/802 000 in MY2007) would be 8E0 920 931 NX (only refurbished available). For newer cars within MY2007 it would be 8E0 920 931 TX. All those numbers are for colour FIS version of cluster. Real RS4 cluster (scaled up to 320km/h) would be 8E0 920 931 GX (up to VIN ending 904 177 in MY2007), 8E0 920 932 MX (up to VIN ending 905 700 in MY2007) and 8E0 920 932 BX for newer cars.

It might be just instrument cluster housing which had been replaced with different one, but if you want to find proper tool to read your cluster you really need to know real part number so you can tell for which car/MY it was used by OEM (as supported cars are listed that way most of the time).

To check real part number one would normally use VAG-COM/VCDS, after connecting to 17 Instrument Cluster one of the informations showed would be part number.

ohhh,,, wait lol just realised a major thing.
So the deal is, this number i gave you, is NOT rs4 cluster part no.
Guy who sold me, switched front glass so the sticker i see is from his original cluster, ive contacted him and asked for the serial number that i has.
Sorry for confusing up here, totally went thru me the part no was from his cluster.

Tho, theres one more thing, when i took this cluster apart, i saw a piece of tape that wos tossed into the engine light socket, as well the plasting (having the numbers on, dont know the name) had engine part cavered on backside. So it could possibly be that the entire cluster could be from anything else than from RS4, and plastic was bought from ebay and cluster sold as OEM RS4 cluster.
Ill get back to you with the part no as soon as i have it.

PS, thanks  for your time and effort here, really appreciate  all the knowledge you share with me / future users.

that went quick, got the part no for the supposedly rs4 cluster, yet to get mine

8E0920931G

Ok, so this should be oldest RS4 cluster.
AFAIK it is good for you as clusters from MY2008 onwards are even harder to work with.
Now you can look for a tool which is capable of reading & writing A4 clusters up to MY2007.

Ohh that is really good news!!
I guess MY2007 & MY2008 mean the year those (clusters) were made or even year of car was made ?

Do you have any clue what would be the appropriate tool for this. I will google for sure, just wanna hear if you know any that might decrease my search time :P

Ive seen the Kline cables use FTDI232R(x) chips (and MPPSv13 too ?) and since i got sparkfuns FTDI with 232R im hoping to have some fund with that, tho i wonder does those cables have any other chips like microcontrollers or something ?
ive no idea if im at right track with my ftdi thinking here, but it sure would be awesome to get something working with it :D

BTW, just thought this might play some role too...
The A4 that i have is not the usual A4... i dont know what these types are called elsewhere  but here in Sweden they are called TS, that means the  220Hp engine. Some say that these B7's are classed under "early 2008"  and some say these are 2007 what ever the model extension.

Genuine AVDI is FTDI based device, but I am quite sure it does have much more inside (it does have updatable firmware, online activation...). Unfortunately proper license + basic AVDI will cost amount in thousand of euros range.
VAG Tacho would be much cheaper (I do not know how this one is built) but I am not sure if this one will work (it is written on its website it does work on A4 up to MY2007) - it costs 390 EUR.
No other tools come to my mind (VAG Dash CAN is not compatible with any Audi model according to their website).

Ah i see, well i will def look for alternatives, also have  friend who creates own circuits who i think i could ask if he has any idea. Now days thanks to arduino and similar stuff, people are able to create and simulate all kinds of tricky stuff.

Anyways, here comes the part numbers you asked earlier.
8E09209 31G - Rs4 cluster
8E09209 01J - currently installed OEM cluster

Since you seem to know quite alot, ill bug you a bit more, Take for example

Kline, VAGCOM, MPPS v13 / v16  cables and OBD2-devices, do you know what is different in these, as in hardware and their abilities ?
There seem to be quite alot of different hardwares available and many of those claim to read and write, whats the diff between OBD2 and kline.
Ive tried to read their descriptions but am struggling with grasping the actual difference.
Kind of feels the kline and mpps are the same thing, just under diff names and probably for diff car models, therefore ill probably get one MPPS v16 from ebay, just to play around.

bump, any questions here are still hot