Pages: [1]
Author Topic: Why is my target lambda not 1 at idle??  (Read 8728 times)
BoobieTrap
Full Member
***

Karma: +3/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 74


« on: March 01, 2017, 02:41:38 PM »

Hi,

Complete noob here...

Been trying to dial in my new ID1000 injectors with wideband ECU (1.8t Engine) and have noticed that my target lambda randomly falls to 0.95 instead of 1 on idle. I can't for the life of me work out the reason for that.
Car is stationary, no detected misfires so what gives?
Car is APX engine recently converted to wideband, no EGT, no secondary o2, no cats, no evap, no n249 (previous owner removed), no SAI.
Logged
gman86
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +45/-128
Offline Offline

Posts: 705


« Reply #1 on: March 01, 2017, 03:52:23 PM »

For cats to work, the mixture needs to switch every so often. Obviously if there's no cats it doesn't matter, but I believe it's an OEM feature
Logged
BoobieTrap
Full Member
***

Karma: +3/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 74


« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2017, 12:36:09 AM »

Is there a map/variable to turn off this "feature"? I followed the s4 wiki to disable everything related to rear CAT and rear O2.
The log clearly lamfa_w as 0.95 at some points during idle (for prolonged periods).
I've attached the final part of the log which shows this (LTFT disabled for now).
Logged
AARDQ
Sr. Member
****

Karma: +11/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 338


« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2017, 09:37:26 AM »

Is there a map/variable to turn off this "feature"? I followed the s4 wiki to disable everything related to rear CAT and rear O2.
The log clearly lamfa_w as 0.95 at some points during idle (for prolonged periods).
I've attached the final part of the log which shows this (LTFT disabled for now).

In your xdf thread, is that file stock or tuned?  Reason I ask is CLRSKA is set to 1.
Logged
BoobieTrap
Full Member
***

Karma: +3/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 74


« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2017, 01:25:26 PM »

The file in the xdf thread is stock *as far as I know*, however I downloaded it from this forum some time ago.
In the file I run CLRSKA is set to 0 along with all the other changes defined in s4 wiki (I double checked every single variable this morning).
The car is still setting lamfa_w to 0.95 on idle, after driving also.
Any idea where I should look (SAI? rear o2? cat model?). What can cause lamfa_w to change other than driver input?

Logged
AARDQ
Sr. Member
****

Karma: +11/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 338


« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2017, 03:31:58 PM »

Not familiar enough with wideband; sorry.  I'm guessing it's still something with cat heating or cleaning.  Doesn't seem to be warm-up regardless of low tmot.  The attached shows the items that affect lamfa_w, at least on narrowband.  Page 1022 of the 1885-page version of the FR, follow them through unless someone else comes up with a quick fix.

Lame help I know; sorry.

Logged
BoobieTrap
Full Member
***

Karma: +3/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 74


« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2017, 04:41:47 PM »

That's very helpful, thanks.

Looks like lamfawkr_w is based on ignition retard, which I have logged and it is 0 across all cylinders, so I can cross that off.
Lamfwl_w is warm up enrichment so this shouldn't be active (and the log shows stable coolant temperature signal).

This leaves Lamrlmin, which is "Target lambda control to improve the combustion efficiency at lower relative loads" according to the wiki on here.
I have checked the definitions in the OLS and sure enough LAMRLMN variable is 0.9531, which matches my log. There is also a map that triggers it, which is RLLAMMN, I think the values are % load and the first entry 16.5; my log shows that the load dips just below that.The Xaxis is RPM first entry is 1480, so looks like all conditions are satisfied.
So I believe I found the map responsible, however, I don't understand whether this is normal behaviour or my APX MAF values/other changed maps are causing this. I can code it out, but should I?

Can anyone confirm what the standard idle load should be on a 1.8t? Should combustion efficiency enrichment be triggered on idle?

« Last Edit: March 02, 2017, 04:53:38 PM by BoobieTrap » Logged
nyet
Administrator
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +608/-168
Offline Offline

Posts: 12271


WWW
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2017, 06:53:52 PM »

If your KRKTE is correct and your idle trims are correct, your load should be correct, unless your MAF (and injectors) are underscaled, such that your idle load is too low.
Logged

ME7.1 tuning guide
ECUx Plot
ME7Sum checksum
Trim heatmap tool

Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your ex
BoobieTrap
Full Member
***

Karma: +3/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 74


« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2017, 12:37:33 AM »

With my ID1000 injectors on 1.8t engine, my krkte is currently 0.0331  based on a calculated starting value of around 0.032 and adjustment using WOT logging. Lambda adaptation is not far off on both WOT and idle with TVUB values 2.7, 1.77, 1.34, 1.09, 0.9 based on starting values from injector spec sheet and adjustment using idle trims.

The MAF values I have directly copied from the APX file (as the MAF is stock APX), the values were are approximately 5% higher than stock values at lower voltages.
My MAF reading at idle is around 2-2.5 g/s.

In any case, I have set LAMRLMN to 1 to check what happens and indeed the requested idle lambda when warm now stays at 1.
However, my misfire counter started to increment, though I couldn't feel the car misfiring (and the RPM is quite steady) so looks like I either have to increase RLSALULL, or increase KFKHFM in the load areas to increase calculated load (if my understanding of load calculation is correct).
Logged
nyet
Administrator
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +608/-168
Offline Offline

Posts: 12271


WWW
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2017, 01:22:01 AM »

you could bump krkte AND MLHFM by the same % to bring load up too

then, under boost, compare ps_w with actual boost and see how far off you are
Logged

ME7.1 tuning guide
ECUx Plot
ME7Sum checksum
Trim heatmap tool

Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your ex
BoobieTrap
Full Member
***

Karma: +3/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 74


« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2017, 02:40:28 AM »

I have attached the ps_w vs actual log extract from my commute this morning.
I'm still a new to this, so not sure what it should look like.
Should ps_w follow the boost curve exactly? Because it looks correct at the top end but quite far off during boost building. Should I bump krkte AND MLHFM but then reduce KFKHFM at the top end?

The car is running hybrid turbo at 22psi, 8.5:1 JE pistons, forged rods, 80mm tip, K&N cone filter and HG FMIC.
Thanks for all the help so far.
Logged
nyet
Administrator
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +608/-168
Offline Offline

Posts: 12271


WWW
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2017, 02:51:15 AM »

Well that's not at all what I was expecting :/

I was expecting to see ps_w UNDER actual boost.

I'm baffled.
Logged

ME7.1 tuning guide
ECUx Plot
ME7Sum checksum
Trim heatmap tool

Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your ex
THANAS
Jr. Member
**

Karma: +3/-2
Offline Offline

Posts: 43

Yes.


« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2017, 08:32:34 AM »

Are the KFKHFM values from the APX file as well?
Logged
BoobieTrap
Full Member
***

Karma: +3/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 74


« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2017, 04:02:10 PM »

No, i have set all table to 1s so i can have a clean sheet for dialing in the injectors. Also my intake is far from being stock.

However i checked the original values and at low rpm/low load they are set to 1s anyway.
Logged
Pages: [1]
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Page created in 0.02 seconds with 16 queries. (Pretty URLs adds 0.001s, 0q)