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vwaudiguy
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« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2017, 03:11:33 PM »
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You know, everyone is referring to rod life in time, when that really has nothing to do with it. How the hell are we supposed to know how the engine was driven/ treated during that time? Even stating in miles (which is a little better but still) tells not much. I know people with very fast cars that rarely push them at all, and people with no so fast cars beat the living shit to redline 30 times a day every day. My point, saying "it's been fine for xxx amount of time" doesn't mean shit. Also, the car does not have to det in order to rip rod. Last guy I saw drove super cautious, and said engine stopped when he was light throttle doing 20 mph. We didn't build/ tune it so I have no idea what was on there, or how it was daily driven. It was a 3071-ish turbo on a stock engine I believe. It's a stress vs. time/cycle thing. Once it's had enough it could probably break @ idle. You'd have to be pretty lucky (unlucky?) for time to run out when you're at idle.  |
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« Last Edit: October 28, 2017, 03:20:57 PM by vwaudiguy »
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"If you have a chinese turbo, that you are worried is going to blow up when you floor it, then LOL."
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_nameless
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« Reply #16 on: October 29, 2017, 05:15:52 AM »
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You know, everyone is referring to rod life in time, when that really has nothing to do with it. How the hell are we supposed to know how the engine was driven/ treated during that time? Even stating in miles (which is a little better but still) tells not much. I know people with very fast cars that rarely push them at all, and people with no so fast cars beat the living shit to redline 30 times a day every day. My point, saying "it's been fine for xxx amount of time" doesn't mean shit. Also, the car does not have to det in order to rip rod. Last guy I saw drove super cautious, and said engine stopped when he was light throttle doing 20 mph. We didn't build/ tune it so I have no idea what was on there, or how it was daily driven. It was a 3071-ish turbo on a stock engine I believe. It's a stress vs. time/cycle thing. Once it's had enough it could probably break @ idle. You'd have to be pretty lucky (unlucky?) for time to run out when you're at idle. there is a kid local to me that WAS all about the small frame turbos, he and his buddy swapped a k04-015 (real one) on his 01 b5 a4. the car was mail order tuned by eurocrustums and semt a rod threw the block on 2 diffrent engines in about 3 months. After that i he contacted me asked my opinion nd i recommended a 30/71 ar .82. After upgraded fuel pump, injectors and turbo install its going on 2 years stock bottom at 20 psi and nothing is hanging out yet. on one of my project car i had a K04-023xl from china on 27lbs e85 and stock rods. I changed my oil every 2000 miles and knowing id make peak tq at 3k id always wait to over 3000rpm before id floor it. drove that car evreyday redline the shit out of it. huge second gear burn outs, high speed sprints of 160mph+ and it never launched a rod. I guess what im trying to say is if you keep good fresh oil in the car and work around the weakness you can have a degree if success with the stock rods |
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Giving your mom a tuneup
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cgramme
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« Reply #17 on: October 29, 2017, 11:46:02 AM »
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The faster the crank turns the more inertia it carries with it in the same direction as the rods on the combustion stroke, which in turn takes stress off the rods. The slower the crank is turning the more it stresses the rods because of a lack of inertia. Predetonation is a huge part of why a lot of rods fail. Every time it knocks it strains the rod more than usual and therefor they start bending. The more the rod is bent the easier it is to bend and then snap. A larger turbo not only helps with a later peak torque but also should blow cooler air than a k04 at it's max limit. The engine/turbo will work less to make more boost and therefor run more efficiently. Cooler air = less knock.
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« Last Edit: October 29, 2017, 11:50:24 AM by cgramme »
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4ringpieces
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« Reply #18 on: October 29, 2017, 12:21:24 PM »
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Bearing damage from detonation, bearing clearances becoming huge and thus gaining massive oil whip aswell
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_nameless
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« Reply #19 on: October 29, 2017, 01:13:55 PM »
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brotella
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Giving your mom a tuneup
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Carsinc
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« Reply #20 on: November 02, 2017, 12:09:23 PM »
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brotella
I've got nothing to add except to say the brotella might be a new thing. |
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slappynuts
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« Reply #21 on: December 03, 2017, 12:45:35 AM »
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The rods fail when the normally aspirated ring gaps on these engines close up and grab the block a little. When this startes to happen the rods cannot take the extra pressure. Keep the EGTs down and even across all cyls and you will be able to push much farther. As soon as I get my 2l built, I am going to pull the head off and open up the ring gap to see what these rods will actually take.
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THANAS
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Yes.
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« Reply #22 on: December 03, 2017, 09:54:08 AM »
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The rods fail when the normally aspirated ring gaps on these engines close up and grab the block a little. When this startes to happen the rods cannot take the extra pressure. Keep the EGTs down and even across all cyls and you will be able to push much farther. As soon as I get my 2l built, I am going to pull the head off and open up the ring gap to see what these rods will actually take.
Nope. |
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Carsinc
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« Reply #23 on: December 06, 2017, 01:16:19 PM »
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The rods fail when the normally aspirated ring gaps on these engines close up and grab the block a little. When this startes to happen the rods cannot take the extra pressure. Keep the EGTs down and even across all cyls and you will be able to push much farther. As soon as I get my 2l built, I am going to pull the head off and open up the ring gap to see what these rods will actually take.
Somebody watched engine masters on youtube... you will fail. The rods bend if what your saying was the problem they would most likey rip the wrist pin out of the piston. |
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mister t
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« Reply #24 on: December 06, 2017, 02:27:12 PM »
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Ok so I must say my car isn't stressed because I have stock k04-023 turbo and 250HP so I can't reach 300 ft/lb.
My rod bend in normal drive low load and RPM and I logged CF for see does I have detonation and for all RPM's I have 0CF for all 4 cylinders (I use stock ignition map).
So are you saying you've logged EVERY WOT pull you've ever done and noted no timing correction? My point is, that it can take only one batch of successive detonations, either from bad fuel, oil in your intake from a bad PCV valve, a hot spot from carbon buildup, etc... which can occur without you ever knowing. Then, the rod and piston are compromised and BOOM, they end up blowing up a day or two later while you're just driving down the road... |
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rnagy86
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« Reply #25 on: December 07, 2017, 12:16:18 AM »
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Running at component limits is always a lottery... why is anyone surprised if an OEM rod goes?
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lphsail21
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« Reply #26 on: December 08, 2017, 12:19:47 AM »
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I've been running a F21 now from 122k to 181k miles, learned and experimented tuning on this motor with no ME7 experience. I nearly blew it up on the first few days due to boost spike from the Frankenturbo's high wastegate setting. After loading the car on the dyno and putting down 344awtq and 309awhp on the quattro/tiptronic at around 3.5k I decided to lower my LDRXN to:
107.42;121.03;127.83;138.05;144.85;151.64;155.07;182.28;189.99;189.99;183.99;177.17;172.06;172.06;172.06;172.06
which put it down into a "safe" zone around 17.5psi I believe, but especially with the horrid automatic trans hardly being able to hang on to the gears while shifting it needed to be set this low. This results in 276 g/s on E85.
Can some of you rod tossers please post your turbo and boost data so we can compare?
Mods here include all the usual junk incl 2.5" pipe large core FMIC, larger EV14s, Franken TIP, ebay DVs, 90mm ebay MAF tuned via MLHFM/KFKHFM, straight pipe 2.5" decat dump exhaust, bosch gauges and 24/7 logging from day 1.
Thanks
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SB_GLI
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« Reply #27 on: December 08, 2017, 08:18:05 AM »
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This results in 276 g/s on E85.
I believe your MAF is overscaled. These things will put out 235 g/s on their very best day. |
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_nameless
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« Reply #28 on: December 08, 2017, 09:31:14 AM »
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I believe your MAF is overscaled. These things will put out 235 g/s on their very best day.
the new ones with the bilet wheel flow more |
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Giving your mom a tuneup
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SB_GLI
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« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2017, 10:13:17 AM »
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the new ones with the bilet wheel flow more
...which is what I have. 375 g/s is quite optimistic. |
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