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Author Topic: 5210hack - nooby basic facts  (Read 6828 times)
jochen_145
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« on: November 30, 2017, 03:32:12 AM »

Hey,

I digg through a lot of the 5210 hack infos here in the forum, but I am too new, to know every well enough and unterstand all neccessary chances.

So I put my basic questions to the noob zone and hope, someone help me out to unterstand some basics right on this.

My biggest problem is, I am application, chance parameters of maps and not digg into the IDA-stuff, so I cannot chance anything in source-code, witch makes impossible for my to re-work the infos found in the threats.

But for me to unterstand:
ME7 got a hard-codes 2560hPa boost limit. So it is not possible to run more than 2560hPa of manifold pressure without chance of source-code.

But what will happend, if I just rescale all pressure sensor to theire half ?
Then actual rl_w will be at half of the pressures and the ME7 works like dopple of engine-capacity in a quite high ambinent Cheesy ?

All pressure related maps, witch have to be "bended" too, are in the S4-wiki:
https://s4wiki.com/wiki/Manifold_air_pressure:Rescale_project

Ok, you have to off-line-recalculate all pressure related logg-values, but I think, this is not impossilble.
So is this a way to start, or more exact, why this isn´t a way to start and a hack of the source-code is a must ?

Thanks for advice

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dream
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« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2017, 02:22:11 PM »

Indeed the limit of the MAP sensor is 2560mbar because its coded in a 8-bit (byte) which can holds a max of 256 bits.

What actually happens with this as you already describe it when you rescale it by half, is when the ECU thinks its measuring 800 mbar its means in the real world the pressure holds 1600mbar.
A little thing on this is that the resolution becomes smaller because of the rescaling (correct me if im wrong).

Anyway I have a list of the maps you should rescale. I have done it already on my 8N0 H-box bin but I havent tested it yet.

As far as I have been looking on this forum I havent seen source code(s) for ME7 ECU’s.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 02:23:54 PM by dream » Logged
nyet
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« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2017, 11:22:10 PM »

Indeed the limit of the MAP sensor is 2560mbar because its coded in a 8-bit (byte) which can holds a max of 256 bits.

no, it is 16 bit, same as ps_w

pretty sure you didn't mean 256 bits either Smiley
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jochen_145
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« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2017, 03:32:11 AM »

Thanks for replay Smiley

Just to unterstand clearly:
there is NO need to chance code of ME7 as fare as I rescale all neccessary maps ?

Is this the way "Bische" went in his example posted here :
http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=3027.0 ?

All posted logs are allready off-line recalculated, so raw-log will show half of the pressure value size ?


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dream
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« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2017, 06:15:41 AM »

no, it is 16 bit, same as ps_w

pretty sure you didn't mean 256 bits either Smiley

Just checkd and indeed 16-bit, thanks for updating me on that. Also I dint mean the 256 bits as im reading it back now.

Thanks for replay Smiley

Just to unterstand clearly:
there is NO need to chance code of ME7 as fare as I rescale all neccessary maps ?

For what I’ve been reading so far, no. If you recalculate you should be able to get this working without editing any source (which I havent seen coming around on this forum).

All posted logs are allready off-line recalculated, so raw-log will show half of the pressure value size ?

Just like I mentioned in my previous post, when you see 2000 mbar in your log it means it would be 4000mbar actual.
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jochen_145
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« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2017, 09:09:05 AM »

[edit]:
Ok, then we have the same unterstanding of the 5210 hack Smiley

I use the same on a DENSO diesel ECU, but differend ECUs, maybe different ways to go


But  now, for me it is clear  Smiley
« Last Edit: December 03, 2017, 04:12:35 AM by jochen_145 » Logged
nyet
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« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2017, 01:19:41 PM »

there is NO need to chance code of ME7 as fare as I rescale all neccessary maps ?

THIS IS CATEGORICALLY FALSE, for the zillion reasons posted over and over again above.

I have no idea where you got this impression.
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nyet
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« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2017, 01:20:30 PM »

For what I’ve been reading so far, no. If you recalculate you should be able to get this working without editing any source (which I havent seen coming around on this forum).

Considering what you know about ps_w etc. how is this even remotely accurate?
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dream
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« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2017, 03:23:19 PM »

I am working on my knownledge there.

The reason why that post isnt that accurate (if you are pointing on that) is becouse I’ve done reading myself into the 5120 hack but I haven’t tested anything yet, so I want to avoid spreading wrong info like I already did on the post above here because of my misunderstanding  Smiley.
For my intrepretation if you work through the mapping rescaling as mentioned in the project_5120.txt you should be capable to run above 2560mbar absolute pressure.

That to say, having the recipe and the ingrediënts doesnt make you a (good) cook Wink
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prj
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« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2017, 03:45:43 AM »

Certain pressure to load conversions are hardcoded, you can not rescale them without modifying the code.

Also, this thread is unneccessary, just read through the 5120 main thread, all these questions are answered there.
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jochen_145
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« Reply #10 on: December 03, 2017, 04:26:08 AM »

Same to me ..  Angry

I just compared a 5120hacked dump to the orignal and allready and four 4 differend bytes in source-code, so now the way is clear for me.

And  one other question to this:
is it reallye neccessary to do this change in IDA, or is it o possible to search for the same bit-stream in a ohter ME7 dump and take of the chances ?


Quote
Also, this thread is unneccessary, just read through the 5120 main thread, all these questions are answered there.
Basicly you are true with this!
But there are nearly a 35 pages to read with a lot of devellopment of this hack. Differend  oppinions and wrong ways, are also described and somewhere corrected.

If there will be a clear (!) hint, that there is a need for the source-code hack at some of the stickys or more importend to the S4wiki, I didn´t need asked again and didn´t start this "nooby-threat" to get it totaly clear for me Smiley

Maybe someone can add this hint to the S4-wiki and we can close this threat or deleat it..

Thanks !  Smiley
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nyet
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« Reply #11 on: December 03, 2017, 11:35:48 AM »

If you bothered to download the 5120 xdf you would see EVERY code patch described in it for the 551M ecu (as far as I know it is complete).

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=3027.msg29815#msg29815

That said:

Literally nobody has the patience to itemize all the locations past what has already been itemized, partly because it is a ton of work and partly because every ECU is different. Feel free to make your own list and edit the s4wiki accordingly (not holding my breath, in 15+ years i've never see anyone make any summary of any kind that wasn't a copy of the s4wiki).

I've already tried to make the tuning page as exhaustive and accurate as I can (its taken me literally years to do so) and i still get shit for it being "inaccurate" or  "incomplete" or "too complicated".

Generally from people who have never once actually tried to make a digestible, well organized summary of anything beyond "oh read 35 pages and figure it out for yourself".

Yes, I'm bitter.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2017, 11:40:21 AM by nyet » Logged

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Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your ex
woj
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« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2017, 07:12:42 AM »

Yes, I'm bitter.

I just gave you +1 for this (not that you do not have enough Wink), but I have to comment - I once committed to do a similar task like your Wiki, only on a smaller scale, smaller community, and, from the perspective of time, much lower quality (mostly due to my relative inexperience in automotive control systems at the time, and which is still lower than the levels seen here). You have every right to be bitter, when you look at such efforts the return is almost zero (well, for me, I do not do anything commercial related to tuning), the amount of crap that you have to process as a result is enormous (this is typically explaining the same thing over and over again). After this I kept wondering why people do this community work, so big thumbs up for you! Myself, I did develop a couple (literally) of personal contacts that did pay back after time, but still not sure it was worth it.

Having said that, it is a matter of fact that a lot of information here is badly spread over several threads and pages and it takes time to find the right one, and it is not about reading it - a skill that seems to be diminishing in the society too, but getting to it. People (myself included) loose patience and ask first, then keep looking. (Not complaining, just saying Wink).
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