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Author Topic: 1.8t ch-box to cb-box crossflash  (Read 5277 times)
Cadensdad14
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« on: April 05, 2018, 07:41:11 PM »

Im starting to work on converting my ch box 1.8t to a cb box 1.8t file.  Id like to get some input on the idea.  I have three reasons why to pursue this:
1.  Im hoping to move to a max load of around 180 and the ch ecu only is effective up to 140.
2.  The CB box is a fully defined file, (much like the M-box in the 2.7t), and has a complete file for multimap and NLS/AL.
3.  The CB box has the EGT sensors active, and I would very much like to add  an aftermarket EGT sensor with a PWM output to control bts fueling as I am not all that sure about how the EGT model is affected by running E85.

So the first obstacle would be compatibility of the ECUs.  From my research, all me7.5 ECUs with this processor speed were identical.  All of the hardware for the EGT sensors is present on the physical ECU, but the codewords are switched off.

The issues I see are that the CB Box runs the BAM engine which is the K04 1.8t with the lowered compression.  I could see this having a effect on the timing tables so I have begun some comparisons between the timing tables in the M box and the CB box, (the AWM, APB, and BEL engines all run the same compression, cylinder size, and valve train).  What Ive found was a significant difference between the interpolated M box maps and the CB box maps.  Ive attached the files.  Up to about 30% load the maps are negligibly different, but as load continues to increase, the m-box steadily drops timing to where the timing at the maz load is 10 to 20 degrees retarded.  On the KFZW and KFZW2 maps I dont see this as being a problem as in tuning timing will be added until CFs are encountered.  However, KFZWOP has an affect on the EGT model based on the delta between the optimal ignition angle and the actual ignition angle.  So where should I go with the KFZWOP map?  Should I run an interpolated 2.7t map in the areas beyond the scale of my 1.8t map?

Also, what maps should be adjusted?
I know ill need to bring the following
ESKONF
LDRXN
FKKVS
KRKTE
TVUB
Coil Related Maps (FTSDRLW, FSWTM, KFSZDUB, KFTSRL
Intake Track Related Maps
MSLUB
Cat Deletes
Load Related Items and other items Ive already tuned

What else will need adjustment? 
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Cadensdad14
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« Reply #1 on: April 10, 2018, 06:39:57 PM »

Does anyone have any idea what I should do with the optimal maps.  Use the BAM engines or interpolate the AWM for higher load?
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_nameless
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« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2018, 03:43:52 AM »

why are you going threw all this work to avoid finding missing maps?
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Cadensdad14
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« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2018, 04:11:23 AM »

I can find the maps.  Its about the load axes.  Even if I use my ch box I still need to extend out kfmiop and kfzwop.
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BoobieTrap
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« Reply #4 on: April 12, 2018, 01:16:41 AM »

You are really creating a lot more work for yourself by doing it this way. To get it running well, you would also need to copy all throttle maps, VE, fueling, trimming maps etc to name a few from your original file as those are likely to be slightly different.

The EGT sensor is really not that useful, it only reads in the range 945-1035°C (according to the wiki). When I converted my APX to wideband (I did end up using the CB file), I spent a lot of time installing the EGT sensor and trying to trip it to check it works, but ultimately I removed it and replaced it with an EGT gauge with its' own sensor.
You are unlikely to reach 945°C unless you are running silly boost on a tiny turbo (I only ever saw above 950°C in the manifold collector when I stressed my original hybrid k04 to 28psi and with timing pull I was getting into negative timing figures). And if you are running such high boost, it is likely that your AFRs are already in the 11-12 region, so enriching further via BTS will likely cause misfires.
I guess what I am trying to say is that the EGT sensor is more of a last resort failsafe to protect the engine in an event of multiple other failures rather than a tuning aid. Especially, since your ECU is already wideband, it basically provides all the information that you need to tune it.
Just get an EGT gauge with a sensor (I use Auberins Gauge - it is cheap, small and reliable) if you are planning on pushing your turbo outside the usual limits.

I would suggest that you just extend the axes on your current file.
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prj
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« Reply #5 on: April 12, 2018, 01:15:22 PM »

The EGT sensor is really not that useful, it only reads in the range 945-1035°C (according to the wiki).
Only true for 2.7TT. 4.2TT and 1.8T have wideband EGT starting at -40C
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BoobieTrap
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« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2018, 04:41:37 AM »

Only true for 2.7TT. 4.2TT and 1.8T have wideband EGT starting at -40C

My bad, my EGT sensor must have been dead as I couldn't get it to give me a reading.
Useful info, thanks.
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Cadensdad14
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« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2018, 04:39:52 PM »

Ok.  So ive cracked into this CH file.  I'm really happy with my results so far.  Spent this weekend getting fuel dialed in on a tank of e85.  Now I'm starting to get into adjusting the load axes on some of my timing maps.  I started with an edit to kfmirl and an adjustment to kfmiop using what I learned in the kfmiop interpolation tool and feel I have a very good handle on the kfmiop kfmirl relationship.  In addition to adjusting the load on kfmiop, I've made careful changes to KFZWOP, KFZWOP2, and KFDMS to accomadate the shared changed axis.  Now I'm working on extending KFZW and KFZW2.  It looks like I need to alter KFDZK, KFSWKFZK, and KFZWMS. 

I was looking into the EGT sensor to hit all my bases.  Its a rallycross car right now on its way to stage rally.  Eventually I'm hoping to add rolling antilag and want to be able to keep and eye on things.

Are there any other maps I need to dig into?


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prj
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« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2018, 10:40:05 PM »

If you are going to be running E85 you don't need EGT.
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