R32Dude
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« Reply #60 on: April 23, 2021, 11:09:17 PM »
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Because zwbas/zwgru =/= zwout. The timing values dont equal whatever is in KFZW most of the time unless you are running without torque interventions in dev mode.
I understand that, but if I remove 6 degrees from kfzw maps( there are 16 on my 7.1.1), shouldn't some timing decrease show up? There seems to be something stopping the timing from decreasing. There is no kfzwn map on these me7.1s ,so what limits the lowest timing? |
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Blazius
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« Reply #61 on: April 24, 2021, 02:33:56 PM »
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I understand that, but if I remove 6 degrees from kfzw maps( there are 16 on my 7.1.1), shouldn't some timing decrease show up? There seems to be something stopping the timing from decreasing. There is no kfzwn map on these me7.1s ,so what limits the lowest timing?
Check the FR. Either you arent changing the right set of maps - only one set is used per variant coding- or there is something else is limiting it, there are many reasons why output wouldnt follow kfzw base values (specially on n/a soft) or even go lower than whatever you have in the tables ( could be all bullshit for all we know). Also there is absolutely a kfzwmn + map in that ecu. |
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R32Dude
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« Reply #62 on: April 24, 2021, 06:52:42 PM »
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Check the FR.
Either you arent changing the right set of maps - only one set is used per variant coding- or there is something else is limiting it, there are many reasons why output wouldnt follow kfzw base values (specially on n/a soft) or even go lower than whatever you have in the tables ( could be all bullshit for all we know).
Also there is absolutely a kfzwmn + map in that ecu.
Thanks Blazius, I'm going to have a go at copying one map to all KFZW 16 maps , zeroing out DZWOLA and KFDZWKG to avoid lambda corrections. As far as the kfzwmn map is concerned, I really cant find any winols files that have it. I looked at complete winols files for 022906032GP, KR,CE and there is nothing there, mine is a KG, I don't have the winols file for that but the three above get me quite far. An earlier model (2004) 022906032DR has the map it. I did a byte search and couldn't locate it in mine. I also looked at the word minimum in german but did not get the needed map. The values in the map from the 32DR are too low to have had an impact even if they existed in mine, so I will focus on the assumption that I missed the KFZW map I needed to edit |
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prj
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« Reply #63 on: April 25, 2021, 02:48:27 AM »
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Really stupid idea to copy the same map.
The maps are for different camshaft phasing and intake flap combinations. The engine needs different timing as a result.
If you want to just offset global timing this can be done through global offset maps, there's more than 1...
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Blazius
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« Reply #64 on: April 25, 2021, 03:17:25 AM »
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Thanks Blazius,
I'm going to have a go at copying one map to all KFZW 16 maps , zeroing out DZWOLA and KFDZWKG to avoid lambda corrections.
As far as the kfzwmn map is concerned, I really cant find any winols files that have it. I looked at complete winols files for 022906032GP, KR,CE and there is nothing there, mine is a KG, I don't have the winols file for that but the three above get me quite far.
An earlier model (2004) 022906032DR has the map it. I did a byte search and couldn't locate it in mine. I also looked at the word minimum in german but did not get the needed map. The values in the map from the 32DR are too low to have had an impact even if they existed in mine, so I will focus on the assumption that I missed the KFZW map I needed to edit
Don't do that. Like mentioned they are for NWS and changeover timing variation, unless you have disabled them. Also indeed ZWMN is pretty low by default anyway it's unlikely thats what it is limiting you. Again tho you havent said anything about your setup, what you are trying to achieve, why the need for retard , did you turbocharge the car etc. |
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R32Dude
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« Reply #65 on: April 25, 2021, 06:06:02 AM »
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Its fine guys, I just did it to make sure the timing changed, and I would have traced the proper map later, but alas it didn't change again!!
All I want to do for now is to retard the timing around 1500-2500 at loads of %~80 and higher. I noticed that the motor knocks around 90% load and retards from 2 to 6 degrees sometimes one or two cylinders other times most of them. I want to alter the map so it just below the knock threshold. I know I could just leave it, but I like the car and want to do this as a hobby. I know the cam maps and the lamfa map do affect the motor when I alter them, so I assumed the timing maps would also work, but it was not to be.
I'm pretty sure the 16 maps were correct but who knows.
I get the feeling the chap who did this turbo conversion ran into the same problem but the car ran fine with boost and the same N/A timing??
So today, as you can see in the pictures, I made the area of interest quite retarded and copied the map to all of the ones in the pic. I double checked the bin file and all changes were saved.
VCDS log showed 95% actual load, and 14 degrees of advance around that area and there was some knock retard. Is it possible that the 16 kfzw maps are just a legacy and are no longer used by this ME7.1.1 ? Has anyone seen kfzwop being directly used to calculate timing, instead of just being used for efficiency calculations? Any ideas appreciated!!
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prj
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« Reply #66 on: April 25, 2021, 06:53:59 AM »
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Instead of posting screenshots, start posting proper logs or just stop posting altogether.
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R32Dude
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« Reply #67 on: April 25, 2021, 07:09:49 AM »
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I don't think logs are going to help you much as you seem to know fa about this ecu
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« Last Edit: April 25, 2021, 08:18:10 AM by OZZIE1 »
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RBPE
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« Reply #68 on: April 25, 2021, 08:37:58 AM »
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KFZWA/2, KFDZK, KFSWKFZK - Need to change kfzw/2 a fair bit more too by the looks of it, shouldn't really need more than that
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RBPE
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« Reply #69 on: April 25, 2021, 08:40:09 AM »
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Oh, there's also always KRMXN and some KRRA tweaks too
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prj
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« Reply #70 on: April 25, 2021, 11:17:36 AM »
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I don't think logs are going to help you much as you seem to know fa about this ecu Just keep bashing your head against the wall, that'll help. As for knowing - it's you who is too dumb to change timing on a ME7. I have a fair few turbo conversions and other things under my belt. Funny how I never had issues with timing. |
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Blazius
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« Reply #71 on: April 26, 2021, 03:02:54 PM »
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Its fine guys, I just did it to make sure the timing changed, and I would have traced the proper map later, but alas it didn't change again!!
All I want to do for now is to retard the timing around 1500-2500 at loads of %~80 and higher. I noticed that the motor knocks around 90% load and retards from 2 to 6 degrees sometimes one or two cylinders other times most of them. I want to alter the map so it just below the knock threshold. I know I could just leave it, but I like the car and want to do this as a hobby. I know the cam maps and the lamfa map do affect the motor when I alter them, so I assumed the timing maps would also work, but it was not to be.
I'm pretty sure the 16 maps were correct but who knows.
I get the feeling the chap who did this turbo conversion ran into the same problem but the car ran fine with boost and the same N/A timing??
So today, as you can see in the pictures, I made the area of interest quite retarded and copied the map to all of the ones in the pic. I double checked the bin file and all changes were saved.
VCDS log showed 95% actual load, and 14 degrees of advance around that area and there was some knock retard. Is it possible that the 16 kfzw maps are just a legacy and are no longer used by this ME7.1.1 ? Has anyone seen kfzwop being directly used to calculate timing, instead of just being used for efficiency calculations? Any ideas appreciated!!
Stop guessing and start logging with me7logger, log all the timing related values and you'll see whatsup. |
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gin+
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« Reply #72 on: May 13, 2021, 06:27:04 AM »
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Just keep bashing your head against the wall, that'll help.
As for knowing - it's you who is too dumb to change timing on a ME7.
I have a fair few turbo conversions and other things under my belt. Funny how I never had issues with timing.
Nevermind. |
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