Pages: 1 [2] 3
Author Topic: B5 S4 single turbo tuning questions  (Read 22860 times)
nyet
Administrator
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +607/-168
Online Online

Posts: 12268


WWW
« Reply #15 on: July 23, 2013, 12:29:44 PM »

Speaking of intake restrictions, remember that spool vs RPM means nothing if RPM rises slower vs time Smiley

Logged

ME7.1 tuning guide
ECUx Plot
ME7Sum checksum
Trim heatmap tool

Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your ex
NOTORIOUS VR
Administrator
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +58/-7
Offline Offline

Posts: 1056


« Reply #16 on: July 23, 2013, 03:57:32 PM »

True I suppose, but with the right combo (even with bigger ports/runners, etc all around) it is possible to have a sorted setup that will spool earlier.

Of course if you're just optimizing the intake side (RS4 manifold/TB) then you just have more volume to fill.

Either way, I think 25 psi @ 3500 & 30 psi @ 3800 is a very lofty proposition.
Logged

SCHNELL ENGINEERING BLOG ·  STANDALONE ECUS · TUNING · DYNO · WIRING · PARTS · VEMS
Google Talk: NOTORIOUS.VR
n00bs start here: http://s4wiki.com/wiki/Tuning
ddillenger
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +641/-21
Offline Offline

Posts: 5640


« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2013, 05:02:35 PM »

Either way, I think 25 psi @ 3500 & 30 psi @ 3800 is a very lofty proposition.

I think lofty is putting it nicely. I'd say out of your mind.
Logged

Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your experience!

Email/Google chat:
DDillenger84(at)gmail(dot)com

Email>PM
Snow Trooper
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +90/-24
Offline Offline

Posts: 689


WWW
« Reply #18 on: July 23, 2013, 08:32:12 PM »

No, bigger turbo= more lag which is not good for street driving

Cool, looks like you have this all figured out then.  Seems Like this post and your question is pretty pointless if you don't want the advice of people with single turbo B5 S4s.
Logged

cartoons?
6A 61 72 65 64 40 76 6C 6D 73 70 65 63
spd579
Newbie
*

Karma: +0/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 10


« Reply #19 on: July 25, 2013, 05:53:23 AM »

Cool, looks like you have this all figured out then.  Seems Like this post and your question is pretty pointless if you don't want the advice of people with single turbo B5 S4s.

Haha... ok.   I've only seen one person comment about running a bigger turbo and there was no reasoning behind it.

I'll also be running a twin scroll turbo with a twin scroll manifold which should also help spool at least 200-300 rpms. 

My primary reason for this thread was to ensure I could taper boost in the upper RPMS so I dont overspin the turbo and hopefully with the boost controller built into the turbo(which I've read I can Grin)

I think I will go ahead and get a turbo speed sensor as well to know what the tuurbo's doing in the upper RPMs.  Can I also run the turbo speed sensor through the ECU or will I need a guage or something?  I'd like to see the digital output if possible on my computer Tongue
Logged
britishturbo
Sr. Member
****

Karma: +14/-1
Offline Offline

Posts: 306


« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2013, 07:16:20 AM »

OK I'm going to post it here even though I posted it on AZ I'll post it all here so everyone sees it.
I've tuned quite a few single turbo setups now - 5858, 6262, 6266, S256, AGP 3.2, 6766 so I can tell you 100% the pros and cons of all the setups.

You can taper the boost down all you want as you head to redline but you will NOT get what you want.
The 5858 was NOT overspinning... this is evidenced by the many many (read 50+) variations I tried of boost vs timing.
Tapering the boost up approaching redline as the engine got away from the knock limit at higher rpm increased power. The 5858 simply does not flow enough air to behave as you desire.

Check this out - 5858 and 6262 on Montys car and the 6766 on my car. All on pump gas and meth:



Pretty cool huh?

The following is very neat, it shows the 5858 and 6262 on Montys car and Celisons FT21 frankenturbos.
This tells you a lot right here:



Again it all depends on what you want to do with the car.
If you spend 90% of your time in traffic or around town then yes a 5858 sized turbo is right for you.
If you do a lot of highway racing and spin to redline a lot then you want something bigger like a 6262 or 6266 sized turbo.
Or if you are crazy like me go with a 6466 or 6766 lol.

Turbo sizing is always a compromise. Always.
Logged
britishturbo
Sr. Member
****

Karma: +14/-1
Offline Offline

Posts: 306


« Reply #21 on: July 25, 2013, 07:17:19 AM »

Oh and yes a 5858 will hit 25psi at 4000rpm on a 2.7 with stock top end.
Logged
britishturbo
Sr. Member
****

Karma: +14/-1
Offline Offline

Posts: 306


« Reply #22 on: July 25, 2013, 07:19:31 AM »

And just for the fun of it... here's a comparison of an E85 Frankenturbo car vs my car running E85 with the 6766 and the nitrous antilag on lol.
I think you can guess which is which ;-)

Logged
britishturbo
Sr. Member
****

Karma: +14/-1
Offline Offline

Posts: 306


« Reply #23 on: July 25, 2013, 07:20:05 AM »

Let me know if there is any specific turbos you would like to see compared... I have many many logs of them all.
Logged
spd579
Newbie
*

Karma: +0/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 10


« Reply #24 on: July 25, 2013, 08:40:42 AM »

Let me know if there is any specific turbos you would like to see compared... I have many many logs of them all.

I really think the best thing for me to do would be to go for a ride/drive in these cars to really understand what I liked/wanted.  You guys should plan a drive down here haha Cool
Logged
britishturbo
Sr. Member
****

Karma: +14/-1
Offline Offline

Posts: 306


« Reply #25 on: July 25, 2013, 08:44:08 AM »

I really think the best thing for me to do would be to go for a ride/drive in these cars to really understand what I liked/wanted.  You guys should plan a drive down here haha Cool

Where are you located?
On August 11th I'm hosting another Audi meet in State College PA, will be many different cars there.
Logged
julex
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +79/-4
Offline Offline

Posts: 923


« Reply #26 on: July 25, 2013, 09:03:14 AM »

Haha... ok.   I've only seen one person comment about running a bigger turbo and there was no reasoning behind it.

I'll also be running a twin scroll turbo with a twin scroll manifold which should also help spool at least 200-300 rpms. 

My primary reason for this thread was to ensure I could taper boost in the upper RPMS so I dont overspin the turbo and hopefully with the boost controller built into the turbo(which I've read I can Grin)

I think I will go ahead and get a turbo speed sensor as well to know what the tuurbo's doing in the upper RPMs.  Can I also run the turbo speed sensor through the ECU or will I need a guage or something?  I'd like to see the digital output if possible on my computer Tongue

If the controller for your speed sensor can output 0-5v analog signal it can be wired into one of two rear o2 sensors and therefore made avilable as a variable in Me7 Logger. Read thread about hooking up zeitronix/WB o2 into stock ECU to give you an idea.
Logged
spd579
Newbie
*

Karma: +0/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 10


« Reply #27 on: July 25, 2013, 09:56:29 AM »

Where are you located?
On August 11th I'm hosting another Audi meet in State College PA, will be many different cars there.

Charlotte, NC  Cry
Logged
Carsinc
Sr. Member
****

Karma: +17/-2
Offline Offline

Posts: 447


« Reply #28 on: July 25, 2013, 09:54:11 PM »

I don't know why all these people are saying you can't spool the turbo that fast,
nitrous can spool huge turbos really fast look at what the supra, and honda guys do.
 Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy
I once put a gt30 something on a VW ABA 4 cyl ran standalone and TDI gears with a vr ring and pinion.
Ended up using a 100 shot to spool it, made 390 something wheel with 8v.
Logged
jibberjive
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +23/-2
Offline Offline

Posts: 536


« Reply #29 on: July 25, 2013, 10:09:39 PM »

I really think the best thing for me to do would be to go for a ride/drive in these cars to really understand what I liked/wanted.
This. Decide what you really want, THEN pick the suitable hardware.  Too often people have ideals about their hypothetical perfect 'happy medium' turbo and forget about the physics/trade-off.  There's always a trade-off, you've just got to decide exactly where on that spectrum your preference lies.
Logged
Pages: 1 [2] 3
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Page created in 0.028 seconds with 17 queries. (Pretty URLs adds 0.001s, 0q)