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Author Topic: A3 1.8t 150 with 225maf,inf,k04 lean under load  (Read 11257 times)
curamrdan
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« on: June 25, 2014, 11:22:28 AM »

Hi, sounds as basic newbie problem.
A3 1.8t 150 2000year, tune file is using maps from S3 210 and TT apy 225file(injector,maf, torque maps scalled).
Idle and part throttle is +-5% trim, but under wot im around stoich mixture(around 14.5-15.0 real AFR measured).
Im not able to make ME7logger to connect ecu so i can log only by VCDSlite.

Few doubts what i can say, AFM is noname 225 housing with semi-noname HUCO sensor from old 150 AFM (new noname look bit cheaper), but reading seems ok, check logs, please.
After some driving recieving P1113 fault of front O2, but lambda regulation still work. Rear O2 is damaged(still connected) and deactivated in tune file. It can have influence on EGT model ?
Altitude correction showing -6.3% (im located in central Europe), i never look at it on another cars, isnt it bit high?
Fuel pressure under load checked and its ok, fuel pump is stock.
Knock retard is up to around 3degs, i lowered kfwz load advance already.

Tried to add hard fuel in lamfa or kflf not seems to work. When i turn TABGBTS to -50c and faktor table all 1.02, added hard in KFLBTS under target load(around 0.70-0.60) it adds a bit, 13afr around 3500rpm than goes to 14.5 again from aroun 4500rpm.
Las try was to turn back KRKTE from 0.083 to 1.02(stock 150 value). As expected trims at idle goes almost -25%, also at cruise, but under load i get 11.0afr to around 13.0 at 5500(then i let off throttle).

In "9" log is mix of 210/225 fuelling + kflf added at load, short WOT pull up to 4000 , i still saw 14.5-15, no change form before.
"10" is forced and added KFLBTS(as noted higher) its was little bit better.
"11" is as before but higher KRKTE.

Logs are only blocks 001 and 002 (to see load, maf g and injector ms). Miliseconds going up as you can see, also O2 sensor doesnt try to correct.
 I didnt found where i can log target lambda and calculated EGT in VCDS Sad

Map pack suit my file. File is shortened from 1MB MPPS read and still recieving memory layout error in Nefmofo at start of flashing(no error in MPPS). Can someone check my file for mistake-s?
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tjwasiak
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« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2014, 12:31:53 PM »

Which injectors are you using? What is your fuel pressure? I would buy new O2 sensor and MAF - OEM or Bosch/NTK. Those parts are too important to use cheap knock-offs.

EDIT: For actual/requested lambda you should use group 031. Do you have EGT sensor? If not you can not check EGT using VCDS...
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curamrdan
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« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2014, 12:40:36 PM »

Injectors are from APY blue with long nose, dont remmeber pt.number now - noted as 386cc.
FPR and rail is stock 150 (3bar).
Original MAF+new O2 will be great, but im not an owner of car, there is limited budget now(long story...)

Checked old logs for AFM readings, and maximum rpm was around 6000 with cca 140load and 150g/s , hot idle is 2.68g/s it seems reading ok?

Just to add, tune is at beginning. Now i hook up AFR meter before adding more boost and found this problem.

EDIT: 031 group, thanks. No real EGT sensor here, but i saw in VCSD some EGT 960celsius, idle or WOT doesnt matter, i dont know what is it.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2014, 12:59:22 PM by curamrdan » Logged
tjwasiak
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« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2014, 01:21:43 PM »

I would not tune it without good O2 sensor. I would not even drive it hard with out it.
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curamrdan
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« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2014, 02:06:19 PM »

I know, but i when i can see live and in logs, that O2 sensor working normally...?


Maybe i found part of my problem. I used FKKVS map from 225, if im understanding right, that Y axis are miliseconds, from 15ms is there 5% upto 15% difference (less correction than original = higher number more fuel, right?).
Similar situation is in KFKHFM, few percent less here too at high load. But there is a AFM-turbo hose from 225 too, so i think 225 map suits beter than stock, isnt?
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k0mpresd
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« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2014, 02:35:30 PM »

stop copying and pasting so many maps. that is probably most of your problem. change tvub and krkte then go from there.
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curamrdan
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« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2014, 03:04:44 PM »

I understand what you mean, but i just want to make base file according Bosch engineers did already. Fine correction tables can be wrong, but similar wrong as untuched, not that huge effect for superlean WOT.

tvub+krtke then first to do is maf scale, isnt? I have 225 maf so why i cannot use 225 scale and forget-maybe i can be different due knock off sensor- how to find it?
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fknbrkn
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mk4 1.8T AUM


« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2014, 06:09:28 AM »

you need to change KRKTE+TVUB and MLHFM for 225housing
if you use TT sensor just copy TT map
if not - you must resize it with mafadjust tool. old dia = 59 and new 70mm. there is difference about 10% when i tried TT MLHFM with 150/180 sensor in TT housing
also you MUST use bosch/orig maf and o2. no way to huco and other noname crap

then log 002-031
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tjwasiak
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« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2014, 08:54:28 AM »

It is much easier to dial one in a time - so first I would dial new MAF and then when it will be perfect I would dial injectors...
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IamwhoIam
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« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2014, 11:42:56 AM »

I
It is much easier to dial one in a time - so first I would dial new MAF and then when it will be perfect I would dial injectors...

I love dialing
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I have no logs because I have a boost gauge (makes things easier)
curamrdan
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« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2014, 02:30:14 PM »

Thanks. So Bosch maf sensor is on the way.

About dialing maf. Maybe im newbie here,but i didnt find any clear guide how to do i, not rought scale it, but fine dialing. Especially on completely unknown setuped car, will be glad for some guide.

fukenbroken: so you said, that 150/180sensor itself is not the same as 225 sensor? I thinked its the same, therefore i named my 150sensor+225housing=225maf. How did you find where exactly you must add in MLHFM "map", logging maf voltage at given RPM?(its one of my many questions, therefore i asking for a guide)
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fknbrkn
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mk4 1.8T AUM


« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2014, 02:48:46 PM »

yes they are different

im logging my pretty new bosch sensor with stock housing and then change housing to TT and logging with it a hour later (same ambient temperature, humidity etc) and saw that second try gives me are ~10% lower g/s. at idle speed it shows only ~2.2 g/s (~2.8 with stock housing)
mafadjust here http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=4839.0title=
no need for guide.. simple DOS tool that do all works for you.
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curamrdan
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« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2014, 01:02:57 AM »

yes they are different...

So final HLHFM was cca with 10% higher values than OEM 225 , right? = Generated by mafadjust tool, not touched then? I asked for fine dialing, you(and others) wroted before, this is just raw scalling.

I understand situations, when i have datalogs with stock 150 maf (some RPMvsLOADvsGramsec values) just comparing flow g/s before a after AFM change and adjusting scale until have same readings as same as possible. Im right?

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fknbrkn
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mk4 1.8T AUM


« Reply #13 on: June 27, 2014, 01:10:44 AM »

you only need to apply mafadjust tool with 59 old and 70 new dia to your file (file must be with stock 150/180 MLHFM map)
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curamrdan
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« Reply #14 on: June 27, 2014, 04:05:43 PM »

Ok, adjusted. I compare curves in graphs, adding solid amount at high flow compared to OEM 225.

Which KFKHFM map is more suitable now - atleast as base for finetune?
FKKVS leaved from 150.

Going to test it soon.
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