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thelastleroy
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« Reply #45 on: January 09, 2015, 05:54:22 PM »
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I think conventional wisdom says dial in fueling first, which in your case means drop in the new injectors and get them adjusted for fuel trims etc.
There isn't any point trying to run an upgraded turbo/higher boost without more fuel. In fact it's a quick way to burn up your exhaust valves or turbo fins....our 1.8t engines don't have much fuel to go around even with stock turbo.
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Three77
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« Reply #46 on: January 09, 2015, 05:58:00 PM »
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This is exactly what I thought, but wanted to clear with those in the know. Thanks!
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thelastleroy
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« Reply #47 on: January 09, 2015, 08:00:41 PM »
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This is exactly what I thought, but wanted to clear with those in the know. Thanks!
This isn't gospel, just my opinion based on reading here. Does your car have wideband o2 sensor? |
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Three77
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« Reply #48 on: January 09, 2015, 09:04:49 PM »
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Yessir. I have a BQ box that I just ported over to CH, and am in the process of converting KRKTE values for the larger injectors. I'll be logging once I install them and will be sharing here to see if I'm going about everything correctly.
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MadCow
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« Reply #49 on: January 10, 2015, 10:44:38 AM »
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Yessir. I have a BQ box that I just ported over to CH, and am in the process of converting KRKTE values for the larger injectors. I'll be logging once I install them and will be sharing here to see if I'm going about everything correctly.
CH eh? I'll be following this, once I get some injectors I can be a guinea pig too. |
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ktm733
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« Reply #50 on: January 10, 2015, 03:15:00 PM »
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can someone start posting logs and info on tuning for injectors? I'm a little bit scared to try tuning injectors after reading all day about this.
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adam-
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« Reply #51 on: January 11, 2015, 10:37:55 AM »
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What injectors are you using?
I'm running 630 Bosch, and used the 550 values for TVUB, sorted KRKTE and my trims are within 3% just now. Gonna go lower, but I've got exams this week, so it's a no go.
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ktm733
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« Reply #52 on: January 11, 2015, 12:38:09 PM »
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About to install 630cc ev 14
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Three77
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« Reply #53 on: January 25, 2015, 01:51:28 AM »
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Alright, I took the plunge and installed my injectors, setting the KRKTE to my calculations and TVUB to the specs that were provided with them. It looks like I'm running a little off on both the stft (~-3) and on the partial adaption (`-.99), which I can deal with right now.
I think my fueling looks great, until I hit about 4500rpm where afr desired really begins to drop and the idc begins to ramp up. Would this be a result of bts kicking in?
I have also raised ldrxn and ldrxnzk a little, because I just couldn't resist after seeing good fueling in a previous log. Even with the very minor changes it's a really different car now.
My plan is to get the fueling completely dialed by aiming for a flat afr, trims close to zero, decreased idc, then moving on.
Attached is the log from today, the changes are to KRKTE, TVUB, KVB, LAMFA, LDRXN, and LDRXNZK.
What would you folks like to see next?
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thelastleroy
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« Reply #54 on: January 25, 2015, 04:57:38 AM »
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Looks like BTS to me. The AFR drops off as the IAT climbs through 25.5*c. Holding the boost pressure into the higher rpm range is going to get pretty hot. What was the ambient temp during this log? Does anyone know if BTS is triggered by ambient temperature vs. IAT as well as calculated EGT? 25*c is not all that warm in the summer.
Three77, have you altered the BTS temp threshold at all? The AFR drops at 935* calc EGT What fuel is this? Might need a richer mixture target to keep temps down.
Question: Will hot days cause an agressive tune to run BTS fueling all day long? I know there are some that use BTS for enrichment, it might be necessary to go this route if a consistant fuel profile is priority. An improved intercooler setup would help too i'm sure.
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« Last Edit: January 25, 2015, 05:10:20 AM by thelastleroy »
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Three77
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« Reply #55 on: January 25, 2015, 06:32:31 AM »
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bts is kind of what I was thinking as well, it really flattens out after 4500. I haven't touched any values for bts, and if I remember correctly it is set to trigger somewhere in the 800s, I'll check later this morning. 11-12 psi at redline shouldn't be too much to ask of the k04 hybrid, but you never know.
Ambient temp was in the high 60s/low 70s, fahrenheit. As for intercooling, I'm running an abd fmic, so that shouldn't be a choke point either. 91 octane is pretty much the best fuel out here, unless you don't mind driving all across town for 93, so you may be right about having to run a bit richer.
I'll raise bts first, what do you suggest as a target point, 950, 1000?
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thelastleroy
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« Reply #56 on: January 25, 2015, 07:14:39 AM »
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Learning of your ambient temp, I'd say the IAT isn't a factor. I checked the FR and it looks like the only reasons to activate BTS are calculated EGT exceeding the threshold and further enrichment thereafter if there is poor calculated ignition timing efficiency. Nyet suggested 11.5-11.8 target AFR with 91octane over in the stg1 thread. I'd go there first and see where (if at all) BTS kicks in. Do you have the compressor efficiency map for your turbo? Which turbo is this specifically, or custom perhaps? Does anyone have a suggestion for an absolute maximum calculated EGT ceiling for 1.8t? We don't want to find out by trial and error......I've read 950*c is ok for a peak, but not sustained number, 900 would be safer? All you really need is FBSTABM and TABGBTS. Should be sufficiently high to begin with, but these 1.8t's tend to run high calculated EGT's.
This is from the stage 1 project. DDillenger, did you mean that the calculated temp tends to be higher than the actual temp? I guess the only real way to know is with pyrometer. My last log for the stage 1 file shows peak at 950*c. I've been running this latest file for almost 3 weeks and pushing my car pretty hard on the daily. So far no issues, but I'm never at the redline for more than a fraction of a second before shifting. If this was for extended high-demand application (race) I would likely bring BTS back into the picture. IIRC I set the threshold for something reckless like 1100*c  Here's the chart for EGT from my last log. |
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SB_GLI
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« Reply #57 on: January 25, 2015, 08:22:12 AM »
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This is from the stage 1 project. DDillenger, did you mean that the calculated temp tends to be higher than the actual temp? I guess the only real way to know is with pyrometer.
I'll try to answer this for him. From all the different 1.8t's I've tuned (golf, jetta, passat, a4) these a4's seem to have higher calculated EGTs than the rest. Use TABGBTS as the threshold for when BTS kicks in, and use FBSTABM as the multiplier for the value out of KLFBTS (maybe not directly) over the current calculated EGT temps. So, set your FBSTABM axis something like 900, 1000, 1050, 1100 and the values to .9, 1, 1.05, 1.1. This will make bts fuel more as temps increase. I'm not totally sure about this, but I feel like the TABGBTS map was wrong in the definition. I swear when leroy was doing his stage 1, bts was kicking in even when the threshold was not yet met. Maybe I am understanding TABGBTS wrong, but I thought no BTS fueling occurs until this limit has been reached. That's not what we were seeing in his logs, which leads me to believe that the map may be incorrectly defined in our map pack. |
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Three77
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« Reply #58 on: January 25, 2015, 12:07:05 PM »
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Nyet suggested 11.5-11.8 target AFR with 91octane over in the stg1 thread. I'd go there first and see where (if at all) BTS kicks in. Do you have the compressor efficiency map for your turbo? Which turbo is this specifically, or custom perhaps? I'll aim for somewhere between .82 and .78, then log to see what that does before moving on to anything else. I'm running a gpop k04 hybrid that pushes around 25/lb min, iirc, which reminds me to contact them for a map. My TABGBTS is set at 839.99*c, and FBSTABGM settings are as follows 889.99 939.99 989.99 999.99
0.00 1.0158 1.0158 1.0158 which happens to coincide with the drop in afr according to the log. I think that SB_GLI is on the right track, but I'll wait to see what the lamfa changes do. Thanks for the help guys, I truly appreciate it. |
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Three77
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« Reply #59 on: January 25, 2015, 10:16:43 PM »
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Here's tonight's log.
I added more fuel via lamfa but it looks like I could bring some more in a little earlier to get into the range that nyet likes for us crappy-fuel-laden folks, and I prolly don't need to request more fuel past 5k. I also copied the LDRXN and LDRXNZK values from the tt240 CA box, and will stick with them until I get fueling dialed.
The 4500 rpm dropoff is at the same place, so while I think that I can get lower afrs on the next run via lamfa, I'm pretty certain that I will need to visit bts in one way or another. It'll be nice to get my idc back in line as well.
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