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Author Topic: Bosch Motorsport MS3.1 diagnostics communication help req  (Read 6608 times)
MS3boy
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« on: January 19, 2016, 09:40:45 AM »

Hi ,
apologies for a long rambling post but here goes. I have the above ecu in my GT3 cup car. I would like to access the DTC's and actual values screens (data). Bosch uses an interface known as MSA Box 11 for this purpose and its own software MODAS. The interface is currently £740 apprx which is a bit steep for the functionality. Bosch have used three interfaces for MODAS since it's introduction KIC2 (a parrellel port interface) MSA Box and finally MSA Box 11 (the latest) The software as i think is well known on here, is available on the Bosch MS site. All the interfaces have K line (single) CAN and ethernet connectivity. I believe the diagnosis connection is managed through the K line. According to the datasheet the interfaces communicate in ISO 9141-2 and KWP2000 to the ecu. Additionally the ECU is locked , though i am assuming this is only for flashing or reading not diagnosis?
I have tried connecting via an elm 327 V1.4 and the Bus initialized on protocol 3 (iso9141-2) and 5 (kwp2000 fast init) . However when i try to get any further(request PID's) i am met with either a neg response 7F or NO DATA. I have seen the firmware datasheet on the Bosch MS website that has info on the diagnosis function but to be honest don't understand it ! Any help greatly received.
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ddillenger
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« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2016, 03:28:48 PM »

Do you have pictures of this ecu? Inside? Have you tried to BDM it? It looks like an ME9.6 hybrid.
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MS3boy
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« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2016, 06:19:33 PM »

Hi,
pictures of outside and datasheet can be found on Bosch motorsport website, under ecu products /archive. Looking through the MODAS config files there is some reference to ME7.6 ? This ecu is 2002 vintage. I didn't want to start opening the ecu up if i can help it.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2016, 06:22:05 PM by MS3boy » Logged
vwaudiguy
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« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2016, 07:20:13 PM »

Do you have pictures of this ecu? Inside? Have you tried to BDM it? It looks like an ME9.6 hybrid.

Someone's excited!  Grin
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dream3R
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« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2016, 07:24:11 PM »

https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iso:std:iso:9141:-2:ed-1:v1:en

Might help.  0x7F they might of stripped it.


Is the docs still not around there was an FDEF of sorts
« Last Edit: January 19, 2016, 08:13:10 PM by dream3R » Logged



How to work out values from an A2L Smiley

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5525.msg52371#msg52371


Starting Rev's http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5397.msg51169#msg51169

noobs read this before asking http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=9014.0title=


ORGORIGINAL 05 5120 creator for Volvo
ORIGINAL Datalogger (Freeware) Author
ORGINAL finder of the 'extra' torque' limits
I don't have ME7.01 A2L I just use ID
MS3boy
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« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2016, 09:32:40 AM »

Thanks for the replies. For info there is a funktionrahmen? Firmware guide in german and english in the nearest equivalent ecu MS3sport in the zip file, found on the Bosch MS website. MS3 sport looks, at least from the outside to be identical to MS3.1 . The difference being MS3sport does not lock out the map. Porsche motorsport locked the maps in MS3.1. According to the docs MS3 sportGT3) is pin configurable to MS3.1 to enable plug and play for GT3. The firmware also appears to be functionally identical to later MS4, at least the same info appears in the MS4 firmware guide. The can timings are hidden in the MS3Sport guide but are shown in the MS4 docs (bet they are the same also).
So having re-read the firmware guide i now understand a little more. Which leads to some questions hopefully someone can answer.
Please correct me if my undertanding is off. oil temps/signals etc appear to be at address 0x77b. with for example oil temp being at row 2 bit 7? How do i display these bits? likewise how do i get to display the bits within the errbyte_x and diag section?  I understand (i think) the conversion factors but not how to get to the data.
My apologies, this is not my field of work i'm just an enthusiast trying to pick up and learn as i go along.
edited. correction MS3 sport has the abilty to configure the pins. MS3 Sport for GT3 is plug and play and comes with workbase (maps?)
« Last Edit: January 20, 2016, 10:23:06 PM by MS3boy » Logged
dream3R
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« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2016, 01:01:58 PM »

Thanks for the replies. For info there is a funktionrammen? Firmware guide in german and english in the nearest equivalent ecu MS3sport in the zip file, found on the Bosch MS website. MS3 sport looks, at least from the outside to be identical to MS3.1 . The difference being MS3sport does not lock out the map. Porsche motorsport locked the maps in MS3.1. According to the docs MS3 sport is pin identical to MS3.1 to enable plug and play for GT3. The firmware also appears to be functionally identical to later MS4, at least the same info appears in the MS4 firmware guide. The can timings are hidden in the MS3Sport guide but are shown in the MS4 docs (bet they are the same also).
So having re-read the firmware guide i now understand a little more. Which leads to some questions hopefully someone can answer.
Please correct me if my undertanding is off. oil temps/signals etc appear to be at address 0x77b. with for example oil temp being at row 2 bit 7? How do i display these bits? likewise how do i get to display the bits within the errbyte_x and diag section?  I understand (i think) the conversion factors but not how to get to the data.
My apologies, this is not my field of work i'm just an enthusiast trying to pick up and learn as i go along.


Link the doc and I'll see if I can point I in the right direction.   Is it kline or can?
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How to work out values from an A2L Smiley

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5525.msg52371#msg52371


Starting Rev's http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5397.msg51169#msg51169

noobs read this before asking http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=9014.0title=


ORGORIGINAL 05 5120 creator for Volvo
ORIGINAL Datalogger (Freeware) Author
ORGINAL finder of the 'extra' torque' limits
I don't have ME7.01 A2L I just use ID
MS3boy
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« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2016, 03:33:00 PM »

Here's the link
http://www.bosch-motorsport.de/media/msd/downloads/software/steuergeraete_3/ms_sport_installation_cds/MS_3_Sport_35CS0X1G_english.zip

the docs are in the zip. It's K line
« Last Edit: January 20, 2016, 03:37:35 PM by MS3boy » Logged
dream3R
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« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2016, 03:52:36 PM »

Looks like u need this stuff....


Environment (not included)
Programming interface MSA- Box II
F 02U V00 327-02
Data logger C 50F 02U V01 164-01 Display DDU 7F 02U V01 130-01 Yaw rate sensor YRS30 265 005 838 12 steps switch for TCF 02U V01 921-01 Switch definition PositionResistance [Ohm]
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How to work out values from an A2L Smiley

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5525.msg52371#msg52371


Starting Rev's http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5397.msg51169#msg51169

noobs read this before asking http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=9014.0title=


ORGORIGINAL 05 5120 creator for Volvo
ORIGINAL Datalogger (Freeware) Author
ORGINAL finder of the 'extra' torque' limits
I don't have ME7.01 A2L I just use ID
MS3boy
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« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2016, 05:08:43 PM »

I am hoping i don't !
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dream3R
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« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2016, 06:21:57 PM »

How is it?   You could code ur own
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How to work out values from an A2L Smiley

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5525.msg52371#msg52371


Starting Rev's http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5397.msg51169#msg51169

noobs read this before asking http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=9014.0title=


ORGORIGINAL 05 5120 creator for Volvo
ORIGINAL Datalogger (Freeware) Author
ORGINAL finder of the 'extra' torque' limits
I don't have ME7.01 A2L I just use ID
MS3boy
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« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2016, 08:04:32 PM »

Curious as to why you think i need the MSA Box and logger ?
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dream3R
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« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2016, 09:23:45 PM »

Well its designed for your ecu is is not with a display?

So you not want to datalog it?

Me I'd write my own kwp logger lol

C167    I'd like to look at the ROM if so out of interest.
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How to work out values from an A2L Smiley

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5525.msg52371#msg52371


Starting Rev's http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5397.msg51169#msg51169

noobs read this before asking http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=9014.0title=


ORGORIGINAL 05 5120 creator for Volvo
ORIGINAL Datalogger (Freeware) Author
ORGINAL finder of the 'extra' torque' limits
I don't have ME7.01 A2L I just use ID
dream3R
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« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2016, 09:40:45 PM »

Found this..

Looks med9,  supports can and kline.
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How to work out values from an A2L Smiley

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5525.msg52371#msg52371


Starting Rev's http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=5397.msg51169#msg51169

noobs read this before asking http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=9014.0title=


ORGORIGINAL 05 5120 creator for Volvo
ORIGINAL Datalogger (Freeware) Author
ORGINAL finder of the 'extra' torque' limits
I don't have ME7.01 A2L I just use ID
MS3boy
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« Reply #14 on: January 20, 2016, 10:15:00 PM »

Have you forgot something? Can't see what "this" is? I'd love to have the MSA box and the bosch logger with the ddu screen is a lovely bit of kit. But as per my first post, they are awfully expensive. I know this can be done without the MSA box . Durametric have managed it with a different interface. Though Duram bundles the extra functionality into his top of the range diagnostic kit, which is ironically more expensive than the MSA box. There are other data loggers that i'd prefer from a cost point of view. The data loggers all hook up to the CAN output of the ecu. 
writing my own code is a bit beyond me. Though i'd like to learn.
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