mkxGTi
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« Reply #45 on: February 20, 2016, 06:17:29 PM »
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You are correct sir!
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dream3R
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« Reply #46 on: February 20, 2016, 07:32:14 PM »
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Yup I know CAN lol.
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junkyarddawg
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« Reply #47 on: February 21, 2016, 10:01:55 PM »
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Here is what i'm talking about btw.
so the first shot is it authenticated, prepping and ready to flash... Then followed by the second screen shot.
Im not familiar with the program you are running but I do have a fully functional mk4 bench harness for ecu and cluster. When I was setting it up I had similar problems to what you have where the program hangs because its not getting what it needs to proceed. In my case it was looking for the immo authorization from the cluster, and as I eventually found out the authorization seems to be coming from the cluster to the ecu via the powertrain CAN databus. The cluster on my 2000 has the gateway module integrated into the cluster so there are 2 sets of CAN wires, one set is for the interior body CAN, and the other is the powertrain CAN. All I needed to do was connect the powertrain CAN from the cluster to the ecu and have a valid key transponder in the coil field and then I could obd flash on the bench. There was no need for a terminating resistor, just make sure to measure the HI and LOW CAN wire voltages and match them up, one has like 2.4 volts dc and the other was like 2.6 volts dc. |
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AmIdYfReAk
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« Reply #48 on: February 21, 2016, 10:07:16 PM »
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Excellent! Thank you, I'm going to hook up a immo coil then adapt the immo and see.
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dream3R
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« Reply #49 on: February 21, 2016, 10:22:07 PM »
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Im not familiar with the program you are running but I do have a fully functional mk4 bench harness for ecu and cluster. When I was setting it up I had similar problems to what you have where the program hangs because its not getting what it needs to proceed. In my case it was looking for the immo authorization from the cluster, and as I eventually found out the authorization seems to be coming from the cluster to the ecu via the powertrain CAN databus. The cluster on my 2000 has the gateway module integrated into the cluster so there are 2 sets of CAN wires, one set is for the interior body CAN, and the other is the powertrain CAN. All I needed to do was connect the powertrain CAN from the cluster to the ecu and have a valid key transponder in the coil field and then I could obd flash on the bench. There was no need for a terminating resistor, just make sure to measure the HI and LOW CAN wire voltages and match them up, one has like 2.4 volts dc and the other was like 2.6 volts dc.
That because you have a MODULE either with 120r termination! The wiring diagrams usually tell a story  Basically = 2 controllers, no can termination = ZIP trust me. Been there done that, lol, that soooo many times, each bus will have 2 termination controllers on each end usually sometimes 60r (60+60) is used in so yo should find them out and stop rewriting BOCH's can spec. You should read that as well I guess  For reference you also need at least two can controllers on a network producing acks. Basically you bumbled your way though it, well one, seriously I did it once when got an non 120R terminated ECU an was kike WTF soldered ar 120 and instant comms. But read Bosch and understand it first. |
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junkyarddawg
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« Reply #50 on: February 21, 2016, 10:33:17 PM »
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That because you have a MODULE either with 120r termination! The wiring diagrams usually tell a story Basically = 2 controllers, no can termination = ZIP trust me. Been there done that, lol, that soooo many times, each bus will have 2 termination controllers on each end usually sometimes 60r (60+60) is used in so yo should find them out and stop rewriting BOCH's can spec. You should read that as well I guess For reference you also need at least two can controllers on a network producing acks. Basically you bumbled your way though it, well one, seriously I did it once when got an non 120R terminated ECU an was kike WTF soldered ar 120 and instant comms. But read Bosch and understand it first. What you are saying is totally true, when I measured the connected network resistance it was 60ohms and the my scope was displaying "mirror images" high and low. |
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dream3R
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« Reply #51 on: February 21, 2016, 10:59:03 PM »
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Yes I know I read the can spec and worked for fours years or with it an continue to.
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dream3R
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« Reply #52 on: February 21, 2016, 11:15:08 PM »
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What you are saying is totally true, when I measured the connected network resistance it was 60ohms and the my scope was displaying "mirror images" high and low.
The way it works is odd but will be superseded soon. Twisted copper pairs etc. Fibre + Ethernet must be common, if not now as it solves the copper twisted pair issue (EMF) |
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« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 06:57:00 AM by dream3R »
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AmIdYfReAk
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« Reply #53 on: February 22, 2016, 07:54:41 AM »
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Can we agree to disagree? The resistor would help elimate noise and other BS... So it's not a bad thing at all
I have a 120r jumping on the cluster side, but it DOES function without ( but there may be a lot more noise in the line )
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mkxGTi
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« Reply #54 on: February 22, 2016, 10:29:59 AM »
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Try one on ecu side aswell (canlines)
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AmIdYfReAk
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« Reply #55 on: February 22, 2016, 12:07:26 PM »
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Sorry, no.
It was established a while ago that the can is functioning correctly in this setup and it was me powerering everything on including switched ignition on at the same time causing the can error... Power the ecunon first then the cluster and it functions perfectly.
The next lead is dealing with the only codes pending in the cluster being the immo coil and key.
So I'm going to see if I can snag a test setup and use that.
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mkxGTi
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« Reply #56 on: February 22, 2016, 12:19:24 PM »
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Sorry, i misunderstood previous post because it had been asked about adding 120r to setup... Glad it works, ive got it working proper with ignition turning cluster/ecu ign on same time where ecu is powered as bench pwr kicks in
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dream3R
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« Reply #57 on: February 22, 2016, 03:44:51 PM »
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Can we agree to disagree? The resistor would help elimate noise and other BS... So it's not a bad thing at all
I have a 120r jumping on the cluster side, but it DOES function without ( but there may be a lot more noise in the line )
well can HAS to be terminated simple as really buddy. |
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AmIdYfReAk
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« Reply #58 on: February 22, 2016, 07:05:38 PM »
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Sorry, i misunderstood previous post because it had been asked about adding 120r to setup... Glad it works, ive got it working proper with ignition turning cluster/ecu ign on same time where ecu is powered as bench pwr kicks in
It's all good, it's just getting a bit off the rails... well can HAS to be terminated simple as really buddy.
Last words don't mean much, buddy. |
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dream3R
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« Reply #59 on: February 23, 2016, 06:47:54 AM »
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It's all good, it's just getting a bit off the rails...
Last words don't mean much, buddy.
CAN-BUS I mean buddy. The ONLY reason it functions is because one of your modules is terminated already. http://inst.cs.berkeley.edu/~ee249/fa08/Lectures/handout_canbus2.pdf |
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« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 06:54:35 AM by dream3R »
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