KBUR
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« on: March 04, 2013, 05:00:43 AM »
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Hi!
I am still far from repeatably successful with getting the car to run after a bench flash with Galetto. Once I got the engine to start a couple of times, but directly after the next flash I had the same problems again. As the flash was successful according to Galetto, both times, I assume I have some problems understanding the preconditions for handshaking the new software with the car.
So after I flash, what do I do?
1) Let the ECU be without connection - how long?
2) mount it in the car - any time required for initiation without key-on?
3) Ignition key on - now what? How long? Should I hear my injectors ticking, and how long?
4) Ignition key off - how long?
5) Engine does crank but not fire. Now what?
Moreover - if I switch between Galetto and NefMoto with the different cables involved, is there a risk I get drivers mixed up?
/K
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cyril279
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« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2013, 06:41:41 AM »
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I recently read through yesterday's thread of you un-bricking your ecu and having issues getting the car to see it. Do you have VCDS to adapt the ECU? Immo III adaption is a different bear than Immo II, and the allroad is prolly immoIII. Maybe you need to play this game about immobilizer "lock times" (select-17-024)? I'll try to find more on that... Galletto and nefmoto definitely shouldn't need diffferent cables. |
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« Last Edit: March 04, 2013, 06:47:35 AM by cyril279 »
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KBUR
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« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2013, 07:16:50 AM »
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No, I only have VCDS lite and never used it.
So you mean my success this morning could also simply be that the IMMO start inhibition had a time out after a sufficient amount of time?
That's tricky, because that means whenever I try something I might trigger resetting the time penalty.
However, currently I cannot connect with NefMoto either, and that seems fishy to me.
Why Galetto (boot), but not NefMoto (normal)?
Isn't that illogical?
Still haven't understood what made NefMoto suddenly reconnect yesterday.
/K
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cyril279
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« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2013, 08:00:17 AM »
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...However, currently I cannot connect with NefMoto either, and that seems fishy to me.
Why Galetto (boot), but not NefMoto (normal)?
Isn't that illogical?
In bootmode, the communication bypasses all security protocol, so there is no restriction to what can be read or written (by Galletto or ME7_95040). Nefmoto and VCDS communicate via key word protocol and ARE therefore subject to the encoded security. Nefmoto will happily read and flash the ecu when using an IMMO-defeated 95040. ...So you mean my success this morning could also simply be that the IMMO start inhibition had a time out after a sufficient amount of time?
That's tricky, because that means whenever I try something I might trigger resetting the time penalty.
I don't have any experience with the lock-times concept beyond what I've read, but that sounds correct to me. VAG's way of rendering the car useless after this mode has been triggered, and an ecu swap is just the thing to do that. I believe that's why most simply immo-off while tuning, then immo-on and adapt once they're happy with what they've got in the car. I may have some of the details crossed though, Immo III is not my bag, and I'm still new to the inns and outs thereof. |
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KBUR
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« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2013, 08:14:28 AM »
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Alright...
Still - it IS the original ECU. Will bench flashing it make it appear as if it is an unknown ECU?
Yeah, that might make sense.
Time to start the next level of learning - all about working around your IMMO.
But if the IMMO is in the car, then NefMoto flasher should be able to connect on the bench, right?
Well, it doesn't just now.
Again, one large problem I am too blind to see or a couple of devils at different places...
/K
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cyril279
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« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2013, 09:17:29 AM »
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But if the IMMO is in the car, then NefMoto flasher should be able to connect on the bench, right?
Well, it doesn't just now.
"in the car" ? I may not understand what you mean here, but The immobilizer consists of multiple components, >>read more here<< and the ECU is one of those components. If you power on an ECU without it's immo-friends connected, the immo protection will go active. Whether on the bench or in the car, and regardless of the status of the immobilizer; Nefmoto, VCDS, vag-k+commander, and any other VAG friendly software should be able to connect to the ECU, and readout some base elements of the ECU (p/n, coding, soaftware number, etc) When connecting via kwp, >>certain info is blocked<<Once the connection is established (via KWP), flashing or reading is dependent on whether the ECU's immobilizer is active, satisfied, or defeated. Nefmoto will be able to read or flash a satisfied or defeated immobilizer. |
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« Last Edit: March 04, 2013, 11:36:06 AM by cyril279 »
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KBUR
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« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2013, 09:48:14 AM »
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Now we are on to something: NefMoto cannot even Connect right now. It could, for a short time, this morning. Ok, time to check threads dealing with connection issues. Maybe look at the log file...
Thanks for the clarification!
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KBUR
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« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2013, 11:12:25 AM »
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When I had trouble connecting with NefMoto the log shows that the cable chip could not be read.
Driver trouble?
Uninstall + reinstall drivers and NefMoto...
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cyril279
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« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2013, 11:16:48 AM »
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are you using drivers specific to that cable? what chip is in that cable? If the chip is an FTDI unit, then using the The latest FTDI drivers, MPROG_3.5 or FTPROG_2.8.0 can be used to verify and modify the cable. |
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« Last Edit: March 04, 2013, 11:29:50 AM by cyril279 »
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KBUR
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« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2013, 12:41:21 PM »
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Hi again,
Yes I'll test several new ways of installing the drivers and NefMoto software :-) (the part I moved to another thread), but right now I need to understand if I did anything stupid when moving from the bench to the vehicle.
In this thread I try to understand whether I do make errors when preparing the first start in the car after successfully flashing on the bench.
If we assume the bench flash succeeded, how to you sync the (original) ECU with the vehicle before you can expect a start?
Unless I know how to do this step correct, how am I going to sort out the mess?
Anyway, without me doing anything I remember, the car suddenly worked this morning after keeping the ignition on a couple of minutes. Somehow I am not certain whether the injectors were ticking that time. That lead me to the insight that I have no idea which symptoms to expect - and that disturbs me a lot.
So somewhere in this history, I must have done something RIGHT. But what was it? Sure like to do that again :-)
/K
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cyril279
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« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2013, 01:06:17 PM »
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When I had trouble connecting with NefMoto the log shows that the cable chip could not be read.
Driver trouble?
Uninstall + reinstall drivers and NefMoto...
04-mar-2013 07:17:05.439: LOG: Opened FTDI device. 04-mar-2013 07:17:05.440: LOG: FTDI device info - Description: USB <-> Serial Serial Number: Device Type: FT_DEVICE_BM ID: 0x4036001 Device Flags: 0x0 04-mar-2013 07:17:05.440: LOG: FTDI ChipID DLL is loaded, checking chip ID... 04-mar-2013 07:17:05.440: LOG: Unable to read FTDI device chip ID04-mar-2013 07:17:05.463: USER: Validated FTDI device is in dumb mode. 04-mar-2013 07:17:05.467: LOG: Starting send receive thread. 04-mar-2013 07:17:05.468: LOG: Send receive thread now started. The inability to "read ftdi device chip" is because of the type of chip (FT232/245BM), and is not preventing Nefmoto from seeing the ECU. I suggest trying a known good file. |
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KBUR
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« Reply #11 on: March 04, 2013, 01:15:12 PM »
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Guess I will try that next.
By the way Cyril, soon I'll have to pay you the way you keep up with my posts :-)
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KBUR
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« Reply #12 on: March 05, 2013, 11:39:14 AM »
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Hi guys, guess I'll answer my question myself then. Normal behavior when putting a correctly flashed ECU in the car is: engine start when key turned. 1) I went all the way back to the original backup file on the bench - Galetto and corresponding program. 2) Switch cable. 3) Checked that NefMoto can connect. No flashing then because of the IMMO. 4) ECU into car 5) Turn key - start. Whohooo! 6) Back to computer, retrace all calibration steps, save new *.bin 7) ECUfix to correct all checksums  Flash that file with NefMoto in the car 9) Turn key - only cranking. Noooooo..... 10) Ignition off. Hmmmm. 11) Turn key - AND WE HAVE A START WITH THE CORRECT BIN!!!! This is great! Hope it lasts a while. Thanks for all the help! /K |
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nyet
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« Reply #13 on: March 05, 2013, 12:24:13 PM »
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Yes. Always cycle the power after flashing your ECU.
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