NefMoto

Technical => Flashing and Chipping => Topic started by: Matt Danger on March 01, 2011, 08:33:06 PM



Title: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Matt Danger on March 01, 2011, 08:33:06 PM
I've been doing some bench flashing to get myself used to the flashing tools and the process in general. Pretty simple, here's how I did it:

(http://img814.imageshack.us/img814/8443/img0581x.jpg)

What you need:
- ECU
- DC power supply
- Flashing cable (Ebay, Galleto, etc)
- Multimeter
- Small gator clips
- Wire
- Small gauge connectors

Set up your DC power source. I have a $17 Pyramid PS-3KX that does 13.8v. I tried using an ATX (computer) power supply (12v) but it would shutdown after a minute or so of powering the ECU and harness. Not sure if I was overloading the power supply or if it was because the power supply was 10 years old.

The wiring is simple. Power the ECU and power the cable. Then connect one K-line wire between the two.

(http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/995/screenshot20110301at929.png)

ECU pins:
Pin 1 -> Ground
Pin 2 -> Ground (can be shared/connected with pin 1)
Pin 3 -> 12v
Pin 43 -> K-line on your ODB cable (Pin 7)
Pin 62 -> 12v

ODBII cable pins (see attached below)
Pin 4 -> Ground
Pin 7 -> K-line on ECU (Pin 43)
Pin 16 -> 12v

ECU pinout reference: http://www.nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=59.0
ODB pinout reference: http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/aftermarket-radio.html NOTE: The ODB pin out on Ross Tech is from the vehicle side.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: phila_dot on March 01, 2011, 10:54:57 PM
Nice, thank you. I found the thread below to be fairly helpful.

http://www.ecuconnections.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1403&p=11290

You will need to login to view it.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Nosbeui on March 02, 2011, 03:43:45 PM
This has been well covered.  I've found an ATX power supply to work well. Don't cheap out on your power supply thats for sure, make sure its very stable.

NOTE: To make a harness that can do all ME7 ECU's (Immobilizer MK4's) Pin 21 on the ECU needs 12v as well.

http://wiki.obdtuning.com/?title=Bild:AudiPorscheSeatSkodaVAGME7.jpg

As from this thread:

http://www.nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=115.15


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Jason on March 02, 2011, 04:21:00 PM
I switched to an ATX supply as well...  I also added this:

http://www.amazon.com/picoUPS-120-Uninterruptible-Power-Vehicle-Security/dp/B004CSRXRO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1299104303&sr=8-1

With an SLA battery, which works awesome, in case of power outage when flashing.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: DJGonzo on March 04, 2011, 09:27:48 AM
Here's the pinouts I use

(http://wiki.obdtuning.com/images/a/ac/VAG_ME7.x.jpg)

and

(http://wiki.obdtuning.com/images/e/e2/OBD2_Pinbelegung.jpg)

You only need K line on OBD plug.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: julex on April 08, 2011, 07:16:20 AM
...

Thanks, worked for me like a charm except for the part where I first wired obd2 plug the way your diagram shows only to realize it is a socket diagram not a plug... Since nobody will be looking at socket side of obd2 port when bench flashing, maybe we can "mirror image" the plug diagram so that it looks like the way plug will when you look at it?

For a power supply I used my trustworthy Vector dual-halogen flashing which has two 6v lead batteries (12v total) in it and was designed as an aid in starting cars. It has enough juice to run ECU almost indefinitely and connects directly to wall outlet too while still supplying nice 12v. The output socket is standard lighter 12v.

One of these guys:
http://www.elightspot.com/v3millionrechspotlight.aspx


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Matt Danger on April 08, 2011, 10:13:22 AM
Quote from: Julex
Thanks, worked for me like a charm except for the part where I first wired obd2 plug the way your diagram shows only to realize it is a socket diagram not a plug... Since nobody will be looking at socket side of obd2 port when bench flashing, maybe we can "mirror image" the plug diagram so that it looks like the way plug will when you look at it?

Good call. I made the same mistake when I first followed the diagram. I've edited my original post and added a new diagram of the OBDII cable pins that should make the instructions more intuitive.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: julex on April 08, 2011, 05:37:59 PM
Perfect!


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: phila_dot on April 13, 2011, 10:32:47 PM
I am looking to replace my shoddy bench harness with something more proffesional. I just received this gem from the FedEx man.

(http://i845.photobucket.com/albums/ab15/phila_dot/77b38117.jpg)

How are you guys connecting to the ATX power supply?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Matt Danger on April 14, 2011, 08:43:21 AM
I've since started using a harness to make connecting the ECU and ODB cable easier. I need to solder up the connections, but here's how it's setup for now.

(http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2948/img0622j.jpg)

(http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/6010/img0610r.jpg)


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: julex on April 14, 2011, 10:09:19 AM
[...]

What a mess  ;)

I ended up using a female obd2 plug and soldered/shrink tubed everything but the couple of terminal connectors I slide over ECU pins when bench flashing. Makes life easier and eliminates grave mistakes.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: judeisnotobscure on April 22, 2011, 08:51:14 AM
I just did this last night... perfect.
I probably had the most ghetto setup yet.
car battery on trickle charge, obdII port and gator clips... still waiting for my ecu connector in the mail.
(http://i714.photobucket.com/albums/ww142/judeisnotobscure/IMAG0297.jpg)


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: c00teriyf on April 26, 2011, 06:37:47 PM
hello i am having trouble getting this to work. i have everything set up the way it should be and i get power to the cable but its unable to connect to the ecu. could the issue be with my pin 42 and 63 that it might be slightly touching another connector? because i cant get it to not touch another connector slightly. or is the issue somewhere else? i use vag-com, ecux all the time without any issues but have not done bench flashing before. any help would be appreciated. trying to flash using the nefmoto program.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: infinkc on June 28, 2011, 08:33:05 AM
Anyone interested in this cable? i will be ordering a few from a supplier overseas, they are about $55-60 shipped.

(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/9771/me7ecu.jpg)


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Matt Danger on June 28, 2011, 11:41:52 AM
That's pretty nice! Not a bad price for a plug-and-play setup. I think I paid $25 for my ECU and OBD harnesses.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: lulu2003 on July 14, 2011, 05:14:41 AM
how far are these ECU Bench Adapters interchangeble?
Meaning, if its ME7, will it fit MED9 also?
or EDC15, EDC16?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Gonzo on July 14, 2011, 05:44:45 AM
Only ME7


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: okkim on August 05, 2011, 07:06:38 AM
Anyone interested in this cable? i will be ordering a few from a supplier overseas, they are about $55-60 shipped.

(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/9771/me7ecu.jpg)

From where could I buy that adapter? I live in Europe, so are those available somewhere in here?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: infinkc on August 05, 2011, 05:25:38 PM
how far are these ECU Bench Adapters interchangeble?
Meaning, if its ME7, will it fit MED9 also?
or EDC15, EDC16?

Well the cable I landed up getting that was for me7 landed up being for edc15.  I landed up modding one to fit the me7. So  sure it will work back on a edc15 also since all I did was shave and cut.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: jluketwo on August 11, 2011, 12:54:22 AM
Anyone interested in this cable? i will be ordering a few from a supplier overseas, they are about $55-60 shipped.

(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/9771/me7ecu.jpg)

Where have you found this? Im interested.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: chienliu1972 on September 19, 2011, 09:11:23 PM
Is the DC power supply suitable? I want to bench flash my ME7.5 ECU with Galletto 1260, but I do not know which power supply to choose, especially in amp.?

Input
AC 110V

Output
DC 0.15 ~ 15V
Amp 0 ~ 2 A


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Tony@NefMoto on September 21, 2011, 02:13:57 PM
For bench flashing you want a power supply that can deliver 12.5 volts and about 1 amp.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: chienliu1972 on September 22, 2011, 07:42:30 AM
I check the bench flash line, Galletto 1260 drivers, and the voltage. However, I always got "Boot mode inactive" error message. Could anyone advise how to solve?

I read again and again the trouble shooting of Galletto 1260 drivers, and re-install the drivers. Put the pin 24 to ground and then connect the 13.5V power supply. 3 seconds later, I remove the ground of pin 24.
Open the Galletto 1260.EXE. Sellect "ECU DATA". The screen shows "starting read ECU data". Then the Galletto 1260 requests me to ground pin 24. I clip "OK" to close the small screen. Finally, the error message shows " turn off dashboard 10 second and turn on dashboard 10 seconds." The screen also shows "Boot Mode inactive" Nothing to be read out.

Could anyone kindly advise your opinion for this problem?

To ground the pin 24 of 29F800BB, the line with 5K resister. I also follow the instrution to add one 2.2K reister to connect pin 21 of ECU socket.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on September 22, 2011, 04:17:24 PM
Did you choose the correct flash type?

It should also prompt you for a file to write to.



Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: chienliu1972 on September 22, 2011, 06:11:31 PM
I tried to study the possible solution again. The below items need to be clarified,

1.How to confirm the ECU in boot mode? - One member of Mefmoto says it could be tried to connect with Nefmoto. Once the KWP-2000 of Nefmoto could not connect to ECU, it means the ECU is in boot mode. Is it correct? In boot mode, may I use vag-con to connect to ECU?

2.How to confirm the Galletto 1260 in normal working condition?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on September 22, 2011, 06:14:20 PM
If the ECU is in boot mode, it will not respond to any KWP commands. It is in CPU boot mode, which means no ME software is running on it at all.

It will only respond to CPU specific *bootmode* flashing commands.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on September 22, 2011, 06:21:36 PM
What did you ground to? You should ground to the BOARD ground. If i had to guess, it looks like you can just bridge these two pins.

Don't bother with a resistor.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: chienliu1972 on September 22, 2011, 08:13:17 PM
I ground the pin 24 of 29F800BB chip directly to the pin-1(Mass) of ECU socket with a wire. Where I marked as pink color in the photo(pin 24 of 29F800BB).
Thanks for your kind assistance.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: chienliu1972 on September 22, 2011, 08:45:43 PM
What I followed the instruction to build the Bench Cable is as attached photo. Then I use Galletto 1260 cable to connect to this Bench Cable and laptop. The bench cable is connected to ECU. Then I powered the bench cable to turn on the ECU.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on September 22, 2011, 08:54:39 PM
Is there another spare ECU you can use to test your setup?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: chienliu1972 on September 22, 2011, 09:29:17 PM
Actually I bought a brand new ECU 06A 906 032QJ and installed into my car in the VW dealer with adaption. Then I removed the original ECU 06A 906 032HA out. I want to read out the tunned bin and write another tunned bin into it. Also, the brand new ECU is for daily use, which I hope to keep it in normal condition without any risk testing.

I repeat the starting of boot mode of my ECU. Using the NefMoto and Vag-Com to connect to ECU, and see whether the communication could be established. When I ground Pin 24 of 29F800BB and power on the ECU, Nefmoto and Vag-com could not connect to ECU. I think that means the ECU is really in boot mode. Then I power on the ECU without grounding Pin 24, Nefmoto and Vag-com could connect to ECU. Does it means Boot Mode of my ECU has been established normally?

Besides Galletto 1260, the Minimon needs what kind of cable to connect to ECU with Boot mode? How to solve the problem " Boot mode inactive" ? I have re-install the drivers of FTDI again and again.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on September 25, 2011, 03:17:38 PM
When I ground Pin 24 of 29F800BB and power on the ECU, Nefmoto and Vag-com could not connect to ECU. I think that means the ECU is really in boot mode. Then I power on the ECU without grounding Pin 24, Nefmoto and Vag-com could connect to ECU. Does it means Boot Mode of my ECU has been established normally?

I feel you are on the right track here... there is something else wrong with your setup.

Have you tried a different PC/laptop?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: chienliu1972 on September 25, 2011, 03:40:39 PM
I tried in three different laptops with Win XP, ASUS Eeepc, IBM X31, & IBM T42. All of them with the same error, "Boot mode inactive".
I first plug Galletto 1260 cable then the XP requests for driver of the new device. Then I introduce the folder with Galletto 1260 driver to XP to install it's driver.
Next, I power the ECU with ground pin 24, plug the Galletto 1260 cable, open the  "Eobd 1260.exe", click "ECU data", no any information of ECU shown. Ok, ok, gives " Boot mode inactive".
I think the cable may be something wrong, but how to clarify it. When using normal protocol of Galletto 1260 to read my vw sharan 1.8T, the Galletto always sticks in XP.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Tony@NefMoto on September 26, 2011, 09:17:06 AM
Turn on the ECU with the boot pin grounded, just before you attempt to connect.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: chienliu1972 on September 27, 2011, 06:27:38 PM
I bought a KWP2000 Plus kit(clone), which may supported bootmode of ME7.X. Does anyone test KWP2000 Plus in bootmode? I would try and report.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: pvl on October 12, 2011, 04:09:06 PM
KWP2000+ NO bootmode . it does NOT work. Use KWP2000+
with benchflashcable to read and write with ME7-Edition software
from AMT cartech.

GALLETTO 1260 in BOOTMODE-read and write works like the added picture.

Bridge 2 red dots for 1-2 secs when applying power to the ecu. I made a
separate switch in my benchflashcable to simulate the ignition-key. The other 12v
is continuously fed. I think that this is your problem. If you undo ALl power, or
put all power on, at once, the galletto doesn't work correct.



Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Gonzo on October 12, 2011, 05:33:41 PM
With MPPS I have no issues on boot mode. Ground pin, power on ECU. Hit write and then let go of ground.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: chienliu1972 on October 16, 2011, 09:59:40 PM
The self-made Bench Harness could be attached photo. (Sorry, I modified the original one)


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: vtraudt on November 12, 2011, 06:35:46 AM
Has anybody made a few ECU plus OBDII harnesses and sells them for a reasonable price.
Looks like one of those plus a power supply.

Why is no one stating how much amp the ECU draws so we can put some accuracy in the 'stable' and 'good' and other non descriptive specifications in the 'power supply requirements'?

Can someone put get the amps it draws? Then we know.

I assume a car battery on a charger would do ok (but voltage is then a bit higher then 13.5V).
How about the 'jumper boxes'?
If computer power supply, what should the 12V rating be (the amps are always printed on the power supplies, so easy to figure out).
Those using computer power supplies: what ratings does yours have that WORK?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: TTQS on November 12, 2011, 02:22:47 PM
I'm interested in principle in this process to read my ECU code but it all looks awfully Heath Robinson and prone to problems for someone who is not an electronics engineer, except with the fancy cable illustrated  ;)

The cable manufacturer is Shenzhen Autodiag Electronics Co., Ltd. This link is all I could find.

http://www.gasgoo.com/auto-products/universal-parts-301/1299140.html

When I looked in ELSAWin for how to get at the ECU which is hidden away in the plenum on a TT, it quoted two procedures for removal: one if there was no protective cover (easy, happy days) and one if the ECU has a protective cover which involves breaking security sealed bolts using a heat gun. I haven't even looked to see which type I have but am put off even at that stage  :(

TTQS


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: infinkc on December 29, 2011, 10:15:47 AM
I'm interested in principle in this process to read my ECU code but it all looks awfully Heath Robinson and prone to problems for someone who is not an electronics engineer, except with the fancy cable illustrated  ;)

The cable manufacturer is Shenzhen Autodiag Electronics Co., Ltd. This link is all I could find.

http://www.gasgoo.com/auto-products/universal-parts-301/1299140.html

When I looked in ELSAWin for how to get at the ECU which is hidden away in the plenum on a TT, it quoted two procedures for removal: one if there was no protective cover (easy, happy days) and one if the ECU has a protective cover which involves breaking security sealed bolts using a heat gun. I haven't even looked to see which type I have but am put off even at that stage  :(

TTQS

i bought one of the cables, but it turned out to be for a different ecu(EDC), i sent them back, they said me7, but it was wrong.  I landed up making one from a used harness instead.

I have been thinking of making a few more if others are interested. 


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: TTQS on December 29, 2011, 11:08:36 AM
i bought one of the cables, but it turned out to be for a different ecu(EDC), i sent them back, they said me7, but it was wrong.  I landed up making one from a used harness instead.

I have been thinking of making a few more if others are interested. 

Shame. I would have been interested, but sure enough, my ECU has a protective cover so I'm not going to mess about with it. Plus, I don't think I'll be any closer to flashing off the tune on it.

TTQS


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: lulu2003 on May 07, 2012, 11:48:29 AM
are there any basic harnesses sold in ebay etc. which only have some banana connectors for power supply and spread into several mini isolated clippers to get some of the pins?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: _Adrian_ on May 22, 2012, 11:54:36 AM
Anyone interested in this cable? i will be ordering a few from a supplier overseas, they are about $55-60 shipped.

(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/9771/me7ecu.jpg)

Does it have the CAN lines connected ?
If so, I might bite on 1 at least


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: gregsback on July 05, 2012, 02:08:15 AM
Hi Guys,
I just saw the discussion regarding the bench harness. I have tested this harness / connector shown on the photo. It does not fit to the RS4 / RS6 ECus!!! even though it was clearly defined in the description of the cable. There are the 4 small grooves missing which allows the connector to be plugged into the ECU.
So I decided to cut it out of an original wiring.

BR
Greg


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Stompen on July 05, 2012, 04:04:04 PM
anyone heard of these guys?
http://www.ecu-cables.de/product_info.php?language=gb&info=p43_byteshooter-vag-me7-1-me7-5--me7-1-1.html&

.. a bit expensive, especially if I want it shipped to Norway, but if it works fine it could be worth to give it a try..


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: trichard3000 on July 08, 2012, 10:37:24 PM
I saw that some others had issues with using ATX power supplies.  I wanted to share how I approached using one for a bench rig I made today, adjusting the 12V output to exactly +12.5V and wiring in some helpful switches.

WARNING: Like just about everything else on this forum, doing this involves modding things in ways that could be dangerous, stupid, or both.  Be careful with electricity and attempt this entirely at your own risk!

When I first cracked the PS open and started testing the various voltages, I found that the 10 amp +12V output was really only putting out +11.4V.  The lower amp -12V line was also reading low and since my PS only had the -12V line rated at .8 amps, I didn't want to use it either.

Google to the rescue!  I rejected a few mods that combined the +12V and -12V lines for 24V and then allowed the voltage to be lowered from there because the .8 amp issue could still be a problem.

I knew that one of the chips on the PS board would control the output.  As it turns out, my PS uses a TL494CN controller chip.  I googled this and found the following link:

http://older.4hv.org/index.php?board=3;action=display;threadid=22578

Using the "Mod #2" technique at the bottom of page one of this thread, I was able to solder in a resistor and potentiometer that allowed me to precisely raise the voltage, watching the output with a digital multimeter, until it hit 12.5V.  (If I tried to turn it up much higher, the built-in safety features of the PS caused it to shut down.)  My higher amp lines are now running very stable at 12.5V.  Your controller chip may be different but if you search on what ever yours uses, you will likely find some similar hacks.

I then wired three switches into the rig:

Switch one:  "master power" that brings +12.5V to the OBD2 connection, to ECU pins 62 and 21, and to switch two.   
Switch two:  "Ignition Switch Emulator" puts +12.5V to ECU pin 3, booting the ECU separately from the OBD2
Switch three:  "Boot Mode Select" grounds out pin 24 to enter boot mode.  (Currently through a 4.7Kohm resistor as per another user's suggestion. Still waiting for my G-1260 so I haven't tested this yet.)

I ended up finding a use for the -12V line anyway.  I had some 12V "automotive" LED's from Radio Shack.  The switches I used were DPDT so I rigged up the LED's to be switched on via the other switch poles using the low amp, isolated -12V. 

Now I have a visual indicator of what's powered up and whether or not the boot mode pin is shorted!  I'll be mounting the switches and the LED's in the cover of the PS.  I had a spare engine wiring harness which provided an ECU connector and my female OBD2 connector is on it's way. 

This was a nice little indoor project for a day when it was just too damn hot to do anything in my garage!  As a complete tuning noob, I'm looking forward to using my new rig and all the helpful info on this site to learn how to tune my car myself.   


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: trichard3000 on September 01, 2012, 11:26:37 AM
rob.mwpropane asked that I share some more details about my bench rig.  Here are some pics and a simple schematic. (My best Forrest M. Mims III impression!)  I'm absolutely sure that I should have some supporting components to really clean this up but it works.  If you know more about electronics than I do, please suggest changes!

I used 12v, "automotive" LED's that I had. The best way though, would probably be to use regular ones and put a resistor on the leg to the -12V line.  Also, I had DPDT switches lying around but DPST would work fine. 

Finally, the clip I used that goes to the bootmode pin is a bit big and can contact neighboring pins.  I trimmed it back a bit but a smaller clip would be better.  If you're not using bootmode, there's no need to open the case and attach the clip.

I wired it all up point-to-point with wiring nuts so I could tweak it. 

Hope this helps!

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-XWG80uWVCyA/UEJNYk7kv0I/AAAAAAAAAO0/s-vnV0CHWt4/s640/benchrig1.JPG)

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-7yhbQPl1nrQ/UEJNXBtuTZI/AAAAAAAAAOs/pacyXFmN4LU/s640/benchrig2.JPG)

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-OYcKAWAGKRQ/UEJNcvfw4dI/AAAAAAAAAO8/HsZP4hxNyws/s640/benchrig3.JPG)

(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-nKyQDGFIDFs/UEJNRbC287I/AAAAAAAAAOk/pqETC7ad8bc/s640/benchrig.jpg)


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Aragorn on September 12, 2012, 04:09:53 AM
Bit of an FYI here.

I've just built myself a bench flashing harness, and have been chasing down "boot mode inactive" error messages for a couple of days.

I knew the ECU was going into boot mode, as the ME7_EEPROM tool worked in bootmode, and VCDS stopped connecting when boot mode was enabled. I assumed the galletto lead was faulty and ordered another, but same issue.

After much puzzling, i noticed a thread where another member was having flashing issues and fixed it by dropping the voltage.

I'd built my harness using a 14v 4A switched mode PSU, as people seemed to suggest connecting a battery charger while flashing, and most battery chargers output between 13.8 and 14.2v. After a rummage i found a 12v 2A PSU and quickly made some temporary connections to it and tried it out, and it worked perfectly.

So it seems that 14v is too much for a Galletto lead, and yet 12v, which most people say isnt enough, worked perfectly.



Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: f1torrents on September 13, 2012, 04:58:12 PM
I believe you were referring to my thread.
It is true. I struggled for 2 days and dropping to ~12v solved it.
Hopefully this info will help others save some time...



Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: aef on September 28, 2012, 03:45:37 PM
This has been well covered.  I've found an ATX power supply to work well. Don't cheap out on your power supply thats for sure, make sure its very stable.

NOTE: To make a harness that can do all ME7 ECU's (Immobilizer MK4's) Pin 21 on the ECU needs 12v as well.

http://wiki.obdtuning.com/?title=Bild:AudiPorscheSeatSkodaVAGME7.jpg

As from this thread:

http://www.nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=115.15


I just stumbled over this. I do have a MPPSv12 which works fine in a S3 8L APY (incar).
Now i did some tests on the bench and build a wire without pin21 because most users say its not necessary. Vagcom worked for me, ME7_95040 tool did his job too.
So i am able to go into boot mode but MPPS and Galletto wont work with or without boot mode.

Now i added a cable for pin21 and put it to +12 (always on). Nothing changed :(
Maybe its necessary to feed it with ignition +12 via switch?

I do not really understand why this pin 21 is necessary. MPPS told me to pull out the dash fuse. So no Immo here, like on the bench.

Will try with only 12v tomorrow ;)


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: prj on September 29, 2012, 02:27:24 AM
You need to connect 62 - 21 is not important, especially if you are flashing in boot mode.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: aef on September 30, 2012, 01:22:53 PM

Will try with only 12v tomorrow ;)

Worked very well with 10-11volt at the moment!


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: owenaudi on November 12, 2012, 12:53:06 AM
Anyone interested in this cable? i will be ordering a few from a supplier overseas, they are about $55-60 shipped.

(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/9771/me7ecu.jpg)
definitly


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: prj on November 12, 2012, 09:16:40 AM
Those cables are complete ripoff.
Go to a breaker, cut off the plug from a million looms there (I got my plug for 2 EUR).
It will probably take you an hour or so to make the cable... ordering it online for stupid money on some obscure website will also take a while, and then you have to wait for it.

(http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1273.0;attach=4361;image)

Cost about 5-10 EUR in materials to make...


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: gregsback on November 13, 2012, 12:04:56 PM
Completely agree!! These cables are rubbish!!
I made the experience...bought it, tried it, thrown it away.

best is really to do it as prj explained.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: slimwadey on March 09, 2013, 04:15:32 PM
Anyone interested in this cable? i will be ordering a few from a supplier overseas, they are about $55-60 shipped.

(http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/9771/me7ecu.jpg)

Looks nice and would save me a trip to the scrapyard
Where can i get one??
I'm UK based


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Ne-FF on March 30, 2013, 11:45:21 AM
Those cables are complete ripoff.
Go to a breaker, cut off the plug from a million looms there (I got my plug for 2 EUR).
It will probably take you an hour or so to make the cable... ordering it online for stupid money on some obscure website will also take a while, and then you have to wait for it.

(http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1273.0;attach=4361;image)

Cost about 5-10 EUR in materials to make...

can i use it on me7.5 (a4 b6 04)? ))
if yes, can you write about this "system" detailed? ))


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: prj on April 24, 2013, 02:59:11 PM
Nothing to write, it's only K-Line and switch on power.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: lulu2003 on July 24, 2013, 08:48:40 AM
help me for my basic understanding:

Bench-flash needs full support (seed key etc.) of flash cable/software to write the ECU by K-Line, even if the ECU is talking via CAN when built in car?
if using Boot mode with opening the case, the flasher only needs some basic protocols to write/read ME7 based ECUs?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: prj on July 24, 2013, 10:32:13 AM
Boot mode is almost like desoldering the chip and then writing it in a programmer to give you an idea.

Basically with boot mode you upload a custom program into the ECU memory to turn your ECU into a chip programmer.
That's all it is at that point, there's absolutely nothing else running on it.

All of the seed keys and so on are a software level feature, when you are programming over protocol with the OS running, so naturally just like they are not needed with a programmer they are also not needed with boot mode.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: lulu2003 on July 24, 2013, 12:24:29 PM
thanks!


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: lulu2003 on July 29, 2013, 12:14:31 PM
depending on me or the tool I canot put it into bootmode but get ECU id on bench which tells me VIN "prog-mode"....???
lost a lot of time with a china galletto v2 tool which had right harness but obviously k-line not working.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: f1torrents on July 30, 2013, 05:49:01 AM
China galletto is picky with voltage.
13~v at about 1.5Amps seems to be my cables sweet spot.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: lulu2003 on August 01, 2013, 03:58:45 AM
China Galletto V2 seem all to have severe problems with K-line??


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: prj on August 02, 2013, 07:30:13 AM
Forget china galletto and ME7 altogether basically.
And yes, most of them have issues with everything :D
You have to replace half the chips and some resistors on the board to get them to work at all.
But even then, writing most ME7 over OBD or over boot does not work.

Just buy original tool, it's not worth it to mess around with these things if you are remotely serious about tuning.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: lulu2003 on August 03, 2013, 03:20:55 AM
as long as I am flashing only my own cars, I do not really consider to spend some thousand euros for a single flash tool. sorry.
And I do not complain, I know: you get what you pay for.

I did realize there are many many mods of replacing half of the parts of china tool, but up to that point of time I had only success with at least reading over CAN.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: prj on August 12, 2013, 03:25:23 PM
Actually everything works on that china tool once you replace the required components.
But, Boot mode ME7 and most ME7 over K-Line does not work.
Don't ask me why, probably was broken in the original version of the tool that got cloned and is fixed in a newer update...

No tool is perfect though. Even original tools have some quirks here and there. I currently use the full Magpro system and I am quite happy with it so far.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: lulu2003 on August 13, 2013, 05:29:35 AM
Yesterday I just fixed my ME7 ECU by using another china galletto that worked with k-line boot mode. Tested all combinations of st10-flash read, external 1MB read/write. Worked fine and very fast (3 min.)
will ship back the other unit to repair, will be curious and report.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Brumbassen on September 07, 2013, 04:35:47 PM
Yesterday I just fixed my ME7 ECU by using another china galletto that worked with k-line boot mode. Tested all combinations of st10-flash read, external 1MB read/write. Worked fine and very fast (3 min.)
will ship back the other unit to repair, will be curious and report.


Hi what program did you use to read the different combinations ??


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Bumblebee on November 12, 2013, 07:01:25 PM
I know this is an old post but where could I get one of those cables from and will it fit an a4 b5 aeb


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ratherb1 on December 05, 2013, 05:20:17 PM
I didn't want to start a new thread but do you guys think 7 amp continuous  13.8 power supply is too much .....I seem to keep frying cables


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ddillenger on December 05, 2013, 05:28:28 PM
Yes that's too much. I run 1amp.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on December 06, 2013, 02:28:22 AM
It shouldn't matter. A more powerful supply should not supply more current than is required to run whatever it is you are running. You should be able to hook up a 10000000000A supply, it it shouldn't break anything.

if you are depending on the current limit of your power supply to prevent you from melting something, you are doing something very very very wrong.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: f1torrents on December 06, 2013, 08:45:02 AM
It shouldn't matter. A more powerful supply should not supply more current than is required to run whatever it is you are running. You should be able to hook up a 10000000000A supply, it it shouldn't break anything.

if you are depending on the current limit of your power supply to prevent you from melting something, you are doing something very very very wrong.

This was my understanding as well.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ddillenger on December 06, 2013, 10:52:01 AM
I use mine for safety. The ecu requires very little amperage, why bother with more?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on December 06, 2013, 10:53:23 AM
I use mine for safety. The ecu requires very little amperage, why bother with more?

I agree, but my point is if a larger PS is blowing things up, you are doing it wrong.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ratherb1 on December 06, 2013, 01:49:31 PM
just a little follow up when i switched my cable to galletto it made it turned to com 6 which is doesnt work with vcds and thats what i tried .......i just changed it to com 2 so hopefully that works .... not really sure why me7 logger didnt connect though ....


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ddillenger on December 06, 2013, 02:36:53 PM
The Galletto bundled cable doesn't work with VCDS.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ratherb1 on December 08, 2013, 09:05:34 AM
Guys on a 2001 a6 with immo do I have to power pin 21 ? 


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ddillenger on December 08, 2013, 09:27:04 AM
Guys on a 2001 a6 with immo do I have to power pin 21 ? 

Yes. Just to be safe, always power pin21. It'll allow you to use your bench flashing cable with all ME7 VAG ecus.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ratherb1 on December 08, 2013, 09:43:45 AM
Thanks daz as always  :)

Applaud


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Letstrythis on April 01, 2014, 03:49:51 PM
I flash cars for a few tuners, I'm looking for the ability to bench flash ME7 ECU's.

I purchased the Raceline Bench Flash tool a while ago before they disappeared. lol (similar to what's pictured below)

(http://www.unitronic-chipped.com/store/media/catalog/product/cache/3/small_image/135x/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/i/m/img_7903_edit.jpg)

I can successfully connect to the ECU with VCDS, but have never been able to flash an ECU with this thing.

So, I have a few questions, Please forgive me if this is common stuff, but I've read so much on here over the past year or so and figured it was time for some clarity.

1. To bench flash a ME7 ECU does it always have to be put in boot mode? Or is this only for bricked ECUs? (I understand the tool I have not have the provisions for this but I have no troubles modifying it for what's needed)
2. Does anyone know, if I'll actually be able to flash ECU's with my chip providers tools? Basically some of my customers live hours and hours away and it would be much easier for me to bench flash the ECU apposed to them driving to see me.

Those are two pretty simple questions I'll start with before I dig any further.

Thanks for the help.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on April 01, 2014, 07:52:12 PM
1. To bench flash a ME7 ECU does it always have to be put in boot mode? Or is this only for bricked ECUs? (I understand the tool I have not have the provisions for this but I have no troubles modifying it for what's needed)

Bootmode isn't needed unless the ECU is bricked.

Quote
2. Does anyone know, if I'll actually be able to flash ECU's with my chip providers tools? Basically some of my customers live hours and hours away and it would be much easier for me to bench flash the ECU apposed to them driving to see me.

No way of knowing w/o details of those tools.

Who is your "chip provider"?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Letstrythis on April 01, 2014, 08:39:30 PM
Thanks for the reply. 

I flash for APR, Eurodyne, Malone and United.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ddillenger on April 01, 2014, 09:01:05 PM
Thanks for the reply. 

I flash for APR, Eurodyne, Malone and United.


If the ecu has an immobilizer it must be authenticated prior to being flashed with most tools. Keep that in mind. Bootmode is less drama, I do it 9/10.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Letstrythis on April 01, 2014, 09:14:14 PM
If the ecu has an immobilizer it must be authenticated prior to being flashed with most tools. Keep that in mind. Bootmode is less drama, I do it 9/10.

Does this mean in my case it would be best to boot mode every ECU? As pretty much all would have Immob active.
Does this mean I will need to use Galletto at some point due to the boot mode process, or should my flashing tools recognize the ECU and flash per normal?
 


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ddillenger on April 01, 2014, 09:30:17 PM
Depends on your tools. I don't know what you are flashing with.

As APR, UM, and pretty much everyone else consider this a dark art, there is little information about their protocols. As such, anything I say is purely speculation.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on April 01, 2014, 10:36:26 PM
Don't bother trying anything with proprietary images. Do your own tuning

They go out of their way to prevent you from doing what you are trying to do... why are you trying to work around it?



Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Letstrythis on April 02, 2014, 08:59:51 PM
Don't bother trying anything with proprietary images. Do your own tuning

They go out of their way to prevent you from doing what you are trying to do... why are you trying to work around it?



I'm definitely not trying to "work around it". I'm only trying to make it easier for our customers. I'm in a small market and we're the only tuner within a 15 hour drive (much further for some), so it's easier for folks to send me an ECU for me to flash on the bench. I can flash older ECU's with an eprom burner, and I can do anything from 2010+ on the bench, however everything from 2000-2009 I can't do. Which sucks considering I know that's all that's pretty much being flashed on here. lol

It appears this many not be as cut and dry as I had hoped.
 


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on April 02, 2014, 09:18:00 PM
I'm only trying to make it easier for our customers.

Pro tuners that don't trust their distributors/partners have no interest in making anything easier for customers... they simply don't want you flashing their stuff willy nilly.

If anything, they want to make flashing their images as inconvenient as possible.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Letstrythis on April 02, 2014, 09:32:52 PM
Understandably so as they're protecting their investment.

I guess I just assumed because I have the tools to flash the ECU's already, that I could simply make something that I would be able to use those same tools to be able to do it on the bench.

Guess I'm chasing my tail.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on April 02, 2014, 11:12:10 PM
In theory, it is possible you can bootmode flash some kinds of protected images for ME7.1

But there are a million ways for pro-tuners to make even that impossible. I'd say you can't do it w/o more details on their protection schemes, which I doubt they will be very willing to talk about.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Letstrythis on April 03, 2014, 08:46:53 AM
Thanks for the help gentleman.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Bi-turbo on August 19, 2014, 11:47:24 AM
Anyone know what the boot pin is for the ecu plug?

What to try and eliminate something, what to boot it via the main ecu plug


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: nyet on August 19, 2014, 01:40:43 PM
Anyone know what the boot pin is for the ecu plug?

Doesn't go to the ECU connector.

If it was that simple there wouldn't be instructions to short a pad on the PCB.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Bi-turbo on August 19, 2014, 11:35:00 PM
Im pretty sure i read somwere on here that there was one of the pins on the ecu plug that can place the ecu in boot mode?


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: ddillenger on August 19, 2014, 11:44:30 PM
Im pretty sure i read somwere on here that there was one of the pins on the ecu plug that can place the ecu in boot mode?

No, you didn't. For some reason you insist on having to be told everything multiple times. There is no way to bootmode the ecu without opening the ecu.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Bi-turbo on August 20, 2014, 02:39:51 AM
There's no need to be a dick is there?

I'm only trying to find out 100%


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: hytron on August 20, 2015, 11:03:23 PM
For my testing purposes I like to use jetski/motorcycle battery. It provides adequate power and it stays pretty stable which is important. I am not sure about ATX power supplies if they can react quick enough to a voltage drop. I would trust a good battery more than an ATX power supply. Just my opinion.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: adam- on August 21, 2015, 12:33:52 AM
Yes, but have the battery on a charger.. There's more risk of the baby battery going dead than a car battery..

Even put the ATX on the battery, would help more than having no supply at all!


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: eliotroyano on January 26, 2016, 08:36:25 AM
Friends I have a big doubt, anyone can confirm if on bench pinout for a I5 20V 2.5L engine with ME7.1.1 ECU is:
Pin 1 -> Ground
Pin 2 -> Ground
Pin 3 -> 12v
Pin 21 -> 12v
Pin 43 -> K-line
Pin 62 -> 12v.

I ask because I have testing it with and without pin 21 and I get all time Not response from controller? But ECU is now 100% working.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: eliotroyano on January 27, 2016, 08:27:03 AM
Friends I have a big doubt, anyone can confirm if on bench pinout for a I5 20V 2.5L engine with ME7.1.1 ECU is:
Pin 1 -> Ground
Pin 2 -> Ground
Pin 3 -> 12v
Pin 21 -> 12v
Pin 43 -> K-line
Pin 62 -> 12v.

I ask because I have testing it with and without pin 21 and I get all time Not response from controller? But ECU is now 100% working.

For your knowledge friends Pin 121 --> +12V due the trick. ECU is a 07K906032J from a MK5 VW Jetta I5 20V 2.5L.


Title: Re: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: jose999 on February 01, 2016, 02:52:39 PM
I had troubles to get bootmode 551c box that i can flash with galletto--> opened ecu pin 24 to ground through 1kohm resistor and then power up after that leave pin 24 to ground as long as you are flashing. Work for me.


Title: How to bench flash your B5 S4 ECU
Post by: Maxwellcom on September 28, 2018, 12:03:50 AM
Looking at the code, the iriver_flash plugin works on .iriver files.  Is that what you are trying to open?