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Author Topic: Narrowband fueling  (Read 13732 times)
nyet
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« Reply #30 on: June 12, 2020, 11:32:35 PM »

Yeah I think I found a acceptable starting point at idle it’s now at 15.1-14.6

this makes zero sense. Idle should be 14.7 because that is the point to having fuel trims, unless you are so far off they're maxed one way or another. If they aren't maxed out, it just means your wideband o2 isn't getting enough flow at idle to get a clean reading.

I don't think you understand why you have a wideband: it's for metering your AFR when lambda control is off.

Also, you still haven't logged o2 sensor voltages for some reason.
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« Reply #31 on: June 13, 2020, 05:14:44 PM »

It does actually sit at 14.7 at idle (well before I installed the pump) but just goes rich when I pass a certain load point. I position the WB in the rear o2 location 16inches away from the hotside which cant be less the 6in or more then 36in according to the instructions. I got it for starters to make some sense of whats going on when I swapped over injectors.

I put in the Walbro just to make sure I have good pressure.


I uploaded a video just to show what its doing at Idle. This is maybe the 3 start up after I installed the pump. just not sure where to go next.

 https://youtu.be/eMyhB533kO0
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nyet
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« Reply #32 on: June 13, 2020, 05:20:54 PM »

goes rich when I pass a certain load point.

You need to figure out if that load point is KRKTE vs TVUB related or open loop/closed loop related.
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atdub
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« Reply #33 on: June 13, 2020, 07:19:31 PM »

I just got back after that pump install, it did some good.

It was right where I wanted it in all areas except WOT. I want to say open loop but cant really back that up at the moment beside monitoring the actual and the way it felt...   
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atdub
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« Reply #34 on: June 18, 2020, 01:10:19 PM »

You need to figure out if that load point is KRKTE vs TVUB related or open loop/closed loop related.

could it be my Maf (66mm ID) just not being able to read pass a certain load point and in return just dump fuel(just a thought)?

got all new hardware filter, fpr and installed the 255lph..and all areas look good until 2sec into WOT goes from 11.7 to 10.3 then would foul out. Im trying acouple diffrent values in KRKTE and TVUB, I could get idle and PT spot on and get WOT to hold for a duration but in the end just ends up rich. Im to the point I flash 3 ecus at a time

kinda lost. just a regular tech/enthusiast pointed out that my K04 might not be efficient enough to run 52lb? if that the case Im dropping in my TD05 and starting there..
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nyet
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« Reply #35 on: June 18, 2020, 01:50:55 PM »

WOT to hold for a duration but in the end just ends up rich.
That sounds like a boost leak


Quote
kinda lost. just a regular tech/enthusiast pointed out that my K04 might not be efficient enough to run 52lb? if that the case Im dropping in my TD05 and starting there..

that makes zero sense. That has literally nothing to do with your fueling problems.
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« Reply #36 on: June 18, 2020, 03:40:27 PM »

That sounds like a boost leak

welp im going back to looking for leaks...
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atdub
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« Reply #37 on: July 03, 2020, 08:04:03 PM »

Im back on my journey to try to figure out the rich condition @ WOT that i was having. I ended up installing my bigger turbo setup cause I figured my problem was rich so why not. plus I figured I might as well have everything set up for this setup..

excuse my ignorance as im still trying to get an understanding dialing in fuel.

So I started where I left off with the 550cc, 255lph all on 3bar just a bigger turbo. KRKTE @ 0.0811 and TVUB set to run Stoich @ idle and PT to follow accordingly. Of course everything is good till I go WOT, then its rich city (10.0 and beyond).

I took a glance @ my trims at the time via VCDS (32 & 33) to find 32 is -25% and 33 is climbing to +17%. So I got to thinking its a lean condition so let me throw some fuel at it via KRKTE. Changed values to 0.0768 let it adapt than things start to look WAY better. Idle and PT still the same but WOT is now starting to hold at 11.5 and I can finally get it all the way thru a gear without it breaking up.

So im like ok, I might finally be getting somewhere BUT I pull up my trims and 32 still eventually gets to -25% (my guess is the limit) but now 33 waves between -1 and +1%, thats where I want to be right? (as solely for STFT)

I know everybody's thinking boost leaks. I spent a day trying different methods with carb spray, compressed air and I even let it smoke for 30mins and sealed every little thing I could find (2 spots) and Vac @-23hg. I was than thinking my 02 maybe going up but its reading and its not even used in open loop, right? Now im starting to point my fingers at the MAF but there no evidence (as far as I know) its faulty other then it'll hesitate alittle sometimes holding it steady @ a certain load point..


Sorry for writing a chapter and my noobish ways but im just still trying to figure this out. This is a short log that I manged to get in traffic and boost looks crazy cause Im running it off spring pressure for now (hence the fault), I figure I get fueling right before working on boost
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nyet
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« Reply #38 on: July 04, 2020, 12:31:21 AM »

Your MAF seems pretty underscaled (ps_w vs pvdks_w), perhaps thats related.

You might also have a vac leak (sucking in unmetered air), your MAF readings are suspicious compared to your boost.
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« Reply #39 on: July 04, 2020, 04:14:37 AM »

Iirc krkte for 550s about 0.05x

There is something completely wrong with your hw if you run it with 0.08

And again
Absolutely stupid idea to tweak narrowband on a custom hw when you have an option to go wideband for a few bucks
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atdub
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« Reply #40 on: July 04, 2020, 09:52:53 PM »

Your MAF seems pretty underscaled (ps_w vs pvdks_w), perhaps thats related.

You might also have a vac leak (sucking in unmetered air), your MAF readings are suspicious compared to your boost.

Its possible or im almost pretty sure it could be because of the location of the MAF with my new setup, Somewhat restricted with like 3inchs between the screen and the core support but it was the only solution at the time with the material on hand but im fixing it soon and maybe drop in a new unit as well.

As for the vac leak. If there is one its hidden VERY well. I looked really hard for one and at this point, Im familiar with every vac source there is thru out my bay..not saying there isnt 1.

Iirc krkte for 550s about 0.05x

There is something completely wrong with your hw if you run it with 0.08

Interesting..Ive used acouple equations and a few GUIs floating around here and some tinkering to come up with that number. But since 0.0768 gave me better results I could be heading in that directions..This is a 1.8t and im running it on 3bar fpr??

Quote from: fukenbroken
And again
Absolutely stupid idea to tweak narrowband on a custom hw when you have an option to go wideband for a few bucks

I get it and Ill probably eventually switch. Im just kinda ducking the software leg work to switch as my method of tuning is using OLS demo with my pretty solid KP put together over the years(to edit with) to manually entering bits in tunerpro to coming up with a bin to flash and it gets pretty tedious


All and all if I were to leave my laptop home and go for a run rightnow its somewhat ok to drive. With the TD05 it gets off its ass @ a reasonable time, I left trims as is since it relearned with 0.07x and it hold 11.5 afr up until late 6krpm, of course boost is ran off spring so its not overshooting and as a piece of mind my last WOT run pulled -3* dwkrz on a somewhat hot day w/o wmi.

but when I do look at trims and such and the feedback im getting from you guys I know its NOT right.. and efficient, so I dont want to ride with it.

 

   
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atdub
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« Reply #41 on: August 26, 2020, 05:37:17 PM »

Decide to jump back on my pig rich condition at WOT and I think I solved it.. I ended up putting my maf sensor in a 3inch housing, scaling it thru maf adjust, centering LTFT @ PT down to -3.6% (so far) and STFT dead @ 0% as long as I can look at it while moving. Now WOT AFR's are exactly how I want them going from 12.8 majority of the time and tapering down to 11.8 by redline. Never felt it run this way since the new setup

It dose hesitate slightly tapping on the ped at a light and was thinking I should fix it thru TVUB but STFT's are both zero and idle is at Stoich soo not sure which area to smooth it out in.     
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