Pages: [1] 2
Author Topic: Rich lambdas in 1.8T AUM  (Read 16151 times)
ibanezgomez
Jr. Member
**

Karma: +10/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


« on: June 22, 2017, 11:49:11 AM »

Hi, a few months ago a tune was done to the car (Golf IV 1.8T AUM 06A906032DR) by a commercial chiptuner and the car did not work correctly, from certain revolutions began to go very rich lambdas and in driving the car was giving jerks.

Because of these problems and no one knew how to give me a solution I decided to learn a little about my ME7.

The first step was to get another ECU to do the tests and load the original software to see possible mechanical faults. My surprise has been when I have seen that even with the soft stock the car is still running very rich:

What can be caused by this behavior ??


Hello, a few months ago a reprogramming was done to the car (Golf IV 1.8T AUM 06A906032DR) by a commercial chiptuner and the car did not work correctly, from certain revolutions began to go very rich and in driving the car was giving jerks.

Because of these problems and no one knew how to give me a solution I decided to learn a little about my ME7.

The first step was to get a switchboard to do the tests and load the original software to see possible faults. My surprise has been when I have seen that even with the soft stock the car is still running very rich (attached image)


What can be caused by this behavior ??

I think LAMBTS is always giving me the richest values ​​I suppose for a high load, but ... Why? Maybe a high IAT? Could this behavior be associated with some mechanical failure?

Attached the complete logs, sorry if they are not very complete. This is the first time I use ME7Logger (awesome program) but I have the problem of not being able to scan more than 25 variables.
Logged

KasperH
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +24/-8
Offline Offline

Posts: 630


« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2017, 12:23:04 PM »

AFAIK, this software is made so it will fuel with KFLBTS as soon as you drive a little spirited.
And that map is pig rich from factory even with a stage 1/2 tune.
Change map to how you want to fuel, or choose a different fueling strategy Smiley
Logged
ibanezgomez
Jr. Member
**

Karma: +10/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2017, 01:54:14 PM »

Yeah, I know it is very rich, but check this logs on a other 1.8T (attached)

It's a 06A906032QN stock, I dont know if car has better peripheral than my Golf (sure has better IC than my SMIC).

But check the desired Lambda, is the same as mine until 4400 rpms.

Maybe if someone has stock logs from Golf IV 1.8T AUM we can compare.

Thanks
Logged

ibanezgomez
Jr. Member
**

Karma: +10/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2017, 01:55:36 PM »

Sorry, the attached
Logged

KasperH
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +24/-8
Offline Offline

Posts: 630


« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2017, 02:49:03 PM »

That's because the BTS trigger is set later than in yours.
All stuff that is pretty simple to change Smiley
Logged
4ringpieces
Full Member
***

Karma: +4/-4
Offline Offline

Posts: 232


« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2017, 02:06:48 AM »

all this is noted on s4wiki
Logged
ibanezgomez
Jr. Member
**

Karma: +10/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2017, 03:00:37 AM »

That's because the BTS trigger is set later than in yours.
All stuff that is pretty simple to change Smiley

I think that's not the problem, I'm triggered full time in the log, trigger is set in my stock at 400 ° C and up to 4400 rpms my desired Lamda is the same as the other 1.8T plot, from there Mine is much richer

The other car also has high exhaust temperatures, although I could not check it in the file I think it also has LAMBTS active.

all this is noted on s4wiki

What? LAMBTS, MAF or IAT effect?

I do not understand English and something may have escaped me.

A link to a section you mean would be very useful, thanks.

Logged

KasperH
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +24/-8
Offline Offline

Posts: 630


« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2017, 04:43:55 AM »

I think that's not the problem, I'm triggered full time in the log, trigger is set in my stock at 400 ° C and up to 4400 rpms my desired Lamda is the same as the other 1.8T plot, from there Mine is much richer

The other car also has high exhaust temperatures, although I could not check it in the file I think it also has LAMBTS active.

What? LAMBTS, MAF or IAT effect?

I do not understand English and something may have escaped me.

A link to a section you mean would be very useful, thanks.



mine does that too, thats why i went with LAMFA and LAMKR for fueling and just disabled BTS fueling.
but i have a suspicion that TKATBTS is the trigger.
see if its set to 100C, if it is; set it to the point where you want to trigger.
Logged
TijnCU
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +60/-4
Offline Offline

Posts: 690


flying brick


« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2017, 06:47:54 AM »

Log tabgbts_w and see how high your modeled EGT values are during all kinds of driving.
You will be surprised how high EGTs are even at idle according to this model, something to keep in mind whentuning tabgbts.
Logged

adam-
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +124/-33
Offline Offline

Posts: 2179


« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2017, 07:13:52 AM »

mine does that too, thats why i went with LAMFA and LAMKR for fueling and just disabled BTS fueling.
Why?  The precision of the BTS maps is much better than LAMFA.  You can build a much nice curve with BTS.  The fueling table for knock is even worse.
Logged
KasperH
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +24/-8
Offline Offline

Posts: 630


« Reply #10 on: June 23, 2017, 07:27:21 AM »

Why?  The precision of the BTS maps is much better than LAMFA.  You can build a much nice curve with BTS.  The fueling table for knock is even worse.

I know, I've been meaning to revert to BTS again because of the better resolution.
But LAMFA and KR have actually been working pretty good for me Smiley
Logged
ibanezgomez
Jr. Member
**

Karma: +10/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2017, 01:45:22 PM »

Log tabgbts_w and see how high your modeled EGT values are during all kinds of driving.
You will be surprised how high EGTs are even at idle according to this model, something to keep in mind whentuning tabgbts.

I'm agree with you seeing tabgm in logs.

This evening I have tried log again with MAF unplugged whit similar result (attached)

EGTs (tabgm) at start of the log 480ºc, 760ºc at wot.

The results are very similar but I think... how precise can be msdk_w (alpha-n estimated air flow) vs mshfm_w (measured airflow)? or my MAF is K.O.? Huh

What diferences must be apreciate in a log with MAF vs a log whit MAF unplugged?

Logged

nyet
Administrator
Hero Member
*****

Karma: +608/-168
Offline Offline

Posts: 12270


WWW
« Reply #12 on: June 23, 2017, 02:22:14 PM »

I'm agree with you seeing tabgm in logs.

This evening I have tried log again with MAF unplugged whit similar result (attached)

EGTs (tabgm) at start of the log 480ºc, 760ºc at wot.

The results are very similar but I think... how precise can be msdk_w (alpha-n estimated air flow) vs mshfm_w (measured airflow)? or my MAF is K.O.? Huh

What diferences must be apreciate in a log with MAF vs a log whit MAF unplugged?



Don't bother to try to correlate this. If alpha-n was accurate you wouldn't need a MAF. It isn't. Maybe if it was speed density.
Logged

ME7.1 tuning guide
ECUx Plot
ME7Sum checksum
Trim heatmap tool

Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your ex
ibanezgomez
Jr. Member
**

Karma: +10/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


« Reply #13 on: June 23, 2017, 03:06:57 PM »

Don't bother to try to correlate this. If alpha-n was accurate you wouldn't need a MAF. It isn't. Maybe if it was speed density.

Ok, I only wanted to check the healthy of my MAF and if it was causing fake measures.

But comparing both logs alpha-n was very very accurate.
Logged

ibanezgomez
Jr. Member
**

Karma: +10/-0
Offline Offline

Posts: 33


« Reply #14 on: July 06, 2017, 12:24:49 AM »

I'm starting to run out of ideas Sad

I've thought to log the lambda variables to see that it's causing such low demands. These are the variables I've seen related to lamda.

ladiff_w         ;{}                                 ; {Regelabweichung Lambda}
lambts_w         ;{LambdaPartProtection}             ; {Lambda f�r Bauteileschutz}
lamelsh_w        ;{}                                 ; {Lambdasoll f�r elektrische Sondendiagnose hinter KAT (Kurztrip)}
lamfa_w          ;{TargetAFRDriverRequest}           ; {Lambdasoll Fahrerwunsch (word)}
lamfaw_w         ;{}                                 ; {Lambdasoll Fahrerwunsch Anteil aus Kennfeld LAMFA}
lamfawkr_w       ;{}                                 ; {Lambdasoll Fahrerwunsch bei Z�ndwinkelsp�tverstellung KR, WL}
lamfaws_w        ;{}                                 ; {Lambdasoll Fahrerwunsch station�rer Anteil}
lamfwl_w         ;{}                                 ; {Offset Motor-Lambda-Soll im Warmlauf}
lamlash_w        ;{}                                 ; {Lambdasoll f�r Test Schwingungspr�fung hinter KAT}
lamrlmn_w        ;{}                                 ; {Lambdasollvorsteuerung zur Verbesserung der Brennbarkeit bei kleinem rl}
lamsbg_w         ;{AirFuelRatioDesired}              ; {Lambdasoll Begrenzung (word)}
lamsoni_w        ;{AirFuelRatioCurrent}              ; {Lambda-Istwert}
lamsons_w        ;{}                                 ; {Lambda-Sollwert bezogen auf Einbauort Lambda-Sensor}
lamzak_w         ;{}                                 ; {Lambdasondenistwert, korrigiert um Zusatzamplitude}

In the attached file there are few more, but not sure if all of they are useful. What variables should log?

Thanks

Logged

Pages: [1] 2
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Page created in 0.025 seconds with 17 queries. (Pretty URLs adds 0.001s, 0q)