SlashProm
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« on: July 14, 2019, 07:23:25 AM »
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Hey guys, just did my first log and the numbers are way off, are there some variables I missed? it's showing WHP and WTQ a lot higher than it should be. Same with actual BHP and Torque and it looks a bit all over the place on the boost.
.csv and image of log below. I've only just started using the logger so I assume it's my error somewhere.
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« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 07:54:32 AM by SlashProm »
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SlashProm
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« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2019, 08:40:13 AM »
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Ok, I just changed expected drivetrain loss from 25% to 8% and it looks a bit more accurate. Am I really making 255 BHP and 305 ft/lbs of Torque? I expected to see around 230 BHP and 250-260 ft/lbs as I don't have an oversized tip and figured I'd have some fine tuning to do.
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SlashProm
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« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2019, 08:46:16 AM »
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Here's the timing preset, not quite sure what to make of it.
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nyet
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« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2019, 10:20:28 AM »
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Ignore crank HP, it is a worthless metric. wheel HP is all that matters. Also make sure your rpm/mph is correct and all of the other inputs (drag, etc) they are unique to each model car.
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nyet
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« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2019, 10:24:54 AM »
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In general you don't care about HP when tuning btw, unless you are comparing back to back runs and want to know which is making more power. Even then small external changes (such as IAT) can have a huge affect on measured HP.
Absolute numbers are pretty much meaningless, and even relative comparisons can be misleading. The primary purpose of the logger is not to measure HP.
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« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 10:34:18 AM by nyet »
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SlashProm
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« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2019, 10:29:58 AM »
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Thanks again for the helpful replies, always feel welcome on this forum.
I'm starting to understand the logs a little. I'm assuming that there is no knock as the graph shows them all moving together and no huge spikes.
I'm looking at Engine load and Maf values now. I've got specified load at 220% max which is the value in my LDRXN. Engine load caps at 135% request and requested and specified follow each other perfectly but cap at around 168% also my maf readings seem a little low with a peak of 125g/s
Just put the correct weight in and it's showing more accurate now at 200 bhp. I know this isn't important right now but seems a bit more reasonable. I just need to work out why Engine load never gets as high as requested and specified/corrected. Unless it's not supposed to on a flat road haha.
I think I need to go back to the wiki, but I'm working under the assumption that I'm being limited by KFLDHBN as my requested load doesn't reach my LDRXN specified load but is in line with corrected.
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« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 11:11:50 AM by SlashProm »
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SlashProm
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« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2019, 01:35:07 PM »
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Bit of an update for you guys, I noticed BTS was kicking in at at 5250 RPM and it matched up with my IDC's spiking to 95% and beyond. I've tapered the boost off some more at 5-6.5k to try and work this out.
Just a quick question, my boost spikes at like 18 psi at 3k but instantly drops around 5 psi by 3.5k and then goes up again a few psi and does it in a few places, does this sound like it's pulling boost or is it an old actuator symptom?
Westgate duty cycle is low even up to 18 psi but it spikes at 95% right at the drop.
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« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 02:28:49 PM by SlashProm »
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nyet
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« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2019, 06:48:58 PM »
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Bit of an update for you guys, I noticed BTS was kicking in at at 5250 RPM and it matched up with my IDC's spiking to 95% and beyond. I've tapered the boost off some more at 5-6.5k to try and work this out.
Just a quick question, my boost spikes at like 18 psi at 3k but instantly drops around 5 psi by 3.5k and then goes up again a few psi and does it in a few places, does this sound like it's pulling boost or is it an old actuator symptom?
Westgate duty cycle is low even up to 18 psi but it spikes at 95% right at the drop.
That is the PID trying to get boost to track requested. Something is definitely wrong with load. Your MAF is either way underscaled or there is some other issue, leading to an abnormally low load and corresponding too much timing. |
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« Last Edit: July 14, 2019, 06:50:50 PM by nyet »
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SlashProm
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« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2019, 02:09:11 AM »
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Could it be the fuelling presets in ECUxPlot? I've edited the maf to 68mm, but I don't know if the offset in g/s is right, it's set to 6.0 as a default
Also what would be considered a CF when it comes to knock and timing pull? would a single volt/degree count and need to be corrected, or is there a threshold that I should be keeping under?
I'll be logging again today after some adjustments, I'm going to start a bit more conservative and build up slowly.
The car feels really good and is pulling better. So either my maf presets are wrong or I've asked for too much boost too early and it's pulling timing to try and keep things in check. I've kept my changes to the minimum. raised LDRXN and 80-100% in KFMIRL, richer LAMFA and slightly lowered the values in KFMIOP on the last load lines.
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« Last Edit: July 15, 2019, 02:55:23 AM by SlashProm »
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Blazius
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« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2019, 05:34:31 AM »
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Could it be the fuelling presets in ECUxPlot? I've edited the maf to 68mm, but I don't know if the offset in g/s is right, it's set to 6.0 as a default
Also what would be considered a CF when it comes to knock and timing pull? would a single volt/degree count and need to be corrected, or is there a threshold that I should be keeping under?
I'll be logging again today after some adjustments, I'm going to start a bit more conservative and build up slowly.
The car feels really good and is pulling better. So either my maf presets are wrong or I've asked for too much boost too early and it's pulling timing to try and keep things in check. I've kept my changes to the minimum. raised LDRXN and 80-100% in KFMIRL, richer LAMFA and slightly lowered the values in KFMIOP on the last load lines.
No , the presets are for hp and tq and etc calculation, the maf values come straight from the ecu.. Knock voltages are useless, it doesnt correspond when you are getting knock or not. |
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SlashProm
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« Reply #10 on: July 15, 2019, 07:48:18 AM »
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Ok. So logging knock is useless? How would I know if I'm getting knock then?
From what I saw in the log it's pulling ignition timing from around 2k all the way to redline, starting at around 3-5 degrees and ramping up to like 12-15 degrees. I'm guessing that this is why I'm not seeing much load as it is being pulled due to timing.
I've lowered the boost quite a bit and tried to log again today but I'm having some problems with the logger. I've been starting the logger and then getting into third at around 1.5k rpm and holding a nice clean pull all the way to red-line, but today's logs aren't showing any data unless I turn off the filter. Not sure why it didn't get a FATS because it was fine yesterday.
But yeah, something is off, if the calculation is anything to go by 125g/s = around 150 BHP, and it's definitely faster than that.
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« Last Edit: July 15, 2019, 07:50:45 AM by SlashProm »
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nyet
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« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2019, 08:02:58 AM »
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Ok. So logging knock is useless? How would I know if I'm getting knock then?
From what I saw in the log it's pulling ignition timing from around 2k all the way to redline, starting at around 3-5 degrees and ramping up to like 12-15 degrees. I'm guessing that this is why I'm not seeing much load as it is being pulled due to timing.
You have this completely backwards. It is possible you are requesting too much timing because the ECU thinks the load is lower than it is. I've lowered the boost quite a bit and tried to log again today but I'm having some problems with the logger. I've been starting the logger and then getting into third at around 1.5k rpm and holding a nice clean pull all the way to red-line, but today's logs aren't showing any data unless I turn off the filter. Not sure why it didn't get a FATS because it was fine yesterday.
You need to figure out why ECUxPlot isn't seeing the run as complete. But yeah, something is off, if the calculation is anything to go by 125g/s = around 150 BHP, and it's definitely faster than that.
That is probably the worst way to estimate if your MAF readings are accurate. |
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nyet
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« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2019, 08:05:05 AM »
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Could it be the fuelling presets in ECUxPlot?
No. The fueling presets are for estimating AFR for the AFR simulator and for measuring (real) flow for the compressor map graph if you have an underscaled MAF. Both are documented. |
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SlashProm
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« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2019, 08:24:21 AM »
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I'll know more when I get the log working. What would cause the car to see less load? I read your reply about incorrect maf scaling but it's a stock maf and I haven't changed any of the maf scaling maps.
I understand though. Timing increases as load decreases. So the car is seeing less load and adding too much timing. Could this be down to too high of an initial load request at low rpm in kfmirl and ldrxn?
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SlashProm
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« Reply #14 on: July 16, 2019, 04:12:35 AM »
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I've been thinking about this load problem. It was my understanding that load was determined by mass air flow and relative manifold pressure. Does that mean I could be looking at a MAF problem, not seeing all the air that's coming in?
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