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Author Topic: Can someone make a "DIY How to define maps" for winols.  (Read 21078 times)
f1torrents
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« on: January 25, 2013, 06:23:15 AM »

Hey guys.
I really want to be self sufficient when it comes to tuning and such.
Nothing crazy just coding out emissions and basic fine tuning.
I find the main hurtle is defining maps.
Even if you have the time and ambition its very difficult to get started.
I'm wondering if someone could show even one example of how to defining a map.

The most common approach is to use a predefined map and .bin and compare to your .bin in question.
A few simple screen shots of this comparison and naming would go a long way in teaching others interested in
finding their maps.

If one of your guru's would be kind enough to put a simple guide together with a example or two, I think
it would go a long as in the community.

Thanks guys...
 Wink


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prj
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« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2013, 06:34:54 AM »

There is no simple guide to this.
It's what separates the wannabes from the greats.

Some of the maps you will be able to find by comparing hex.
Some you will be able to find by trial and error.
But unless you understand how to disassemble the binary and read machine code to see where things are looked up, you will never find many single value things or spend a stupid amount of time searching for them. Especially if you do not have a similar binary with an available damos.
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littco
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« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2013, 07:32:01 AM »

I can't really post pictures as I haven't found the print screen function on a mac VM

Anyway

If you have a good know definition similar to the map you want to define then you can easily use MTX's map analyser to overlay the 2 maps, slide the maps till they line up and then read off the new address.

For instance typically the 1.8t me7.5 ecus are very similar, there is 018CB file fully defined ( with the odd mistake) and you can use that to compile your new definition file by the method described above, I would imagine that you could do something very similar with winols to overlay 2 maps.

Like most things, once you get the hang of it, it's actually not that hard, and once you know what a map looks like you don't need an overlay to find it. Problem comes though the variables as they all tend to be 0-1-2-3 etc and when you have a run of 20 or so in a line it's hard to match them up.

down load map analayser and give it ago..
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nyet
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« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2013, 06:44:59 PM »

It's what separates the wannabes from the greats.

sigh. its not like we're developing a fucking cure for cancer here.
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ddillenger
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« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2013, 06:50:39 PM »

lol
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jimmcgee5
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« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2013, 07:29:56 PM »

sigh. its not like we're developing a fucking cure for cancer here.

and thats what will stop people asking stuff on here , Anytime anyone posts a question ,  he gets a snide comment about being a newbie , this place is turning into vortex , since a couple of guys found out Tony has went missing , they are running a mock in here .

jim
« Last Edit: January 25, 2013, 08:59:00 PM by nyet » Logged
nyet
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« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2013, 08:15:15 PM »

This has nothing to do with Tony.

It has to do with how the tuner industry self-selects for raging egomaniacs.

prj has contributed far more than most. He feels like the noobs don't properly appreciate it. And the noobs feel like he's too demanding of worship.

Neither want to budge. What do you EXPECT the result is going to be?

Me? I never expect gratitude for anything I do. It makes my life much easier. I've long stopped expecting everything around me to change. The only thing I can do is watch my own behavior.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2013, 08:18:46 PM by nyet » Logged

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k0mpresd
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« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2013, 08:36:38 PM »

i think the self destructing fact is that back several years ago NONE of this information was available. no matter where you looked.

you had to be part of a very tight niche circle to gain any of this

its a little hard to just give it up like that when youve spent YEARS learning what you know.
tony had a great idea but the downside is most people want to take advantage of it.

its like that on lots of boards i visit. you spend years there working with the hardware and software. then someone that has never touched whatever it is theyre working with pops on and just expects someone to give them the answer. its a very delicate balance.


[oh crap, sorry man, i hit modify instead of reply - i tried to restore as much of your post as I could but i lost some of it Sad - nyet]
« Last Edit: January 25, 2013, 08:55:21 PM by nyet » Logged
nyet
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« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2013, 08:53:17 PM »

Quote
i think the self destructing fact is that back several years ago NONE of this information was available. no matter where you looked.
Speaking of not getting any credit, I wonder when that changed Tongue

Quote
you had to be part of a very tight niche circle to gain any of this.

Yes. A tight circle of insufferable, insecure, vain, petty assholes.

Quote
its a little hard to just give it up like that when youve spent YEARS learning what you know.

BOO FUCKING HOO. I am sick and tired of being told this is a problem. I simply do not sympathize in the least. There is nothing to give up. I have no idea why there such a huge sense of personal ownership in information that wasn't theirs to begin with. None of those pricks invented (let alone wrote) ERCOS or Motronic.

Quote
tony had a great idea but the downside is most people want to take advantage of it.

It's only a downside if you are an insufferable, selfish, vain, narcissistic prick. Did i mention "self-selecting" in this post yet?

Quote
its like that on lots of boards i visit. you spend years there working with the hardware and software. then someone that has never touched whatever it is theyre working with pops on and just expects someone to give them the answer. its a very delicate balance.

Ignoring people isn't hard. Its trivial.

You know what is hard? Explaining what you know to somebody who doesn't know as much as you do. That's hard. THAT is the real challenge.
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ME7.1 tuning guide (READ FIRST)
ECUx Plot
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Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your experience.
jimmcgee5
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« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2013, 08:56:26 PM »

 Roll Eyes I was not geting at you NYET , it was the guy with the big head above you lol ,
I read this forum to try and learn stuff , the hardwear I am comfertable with , its the programing bit that throws me , oh and I am not a newbie , started on machine code and stuff back in the days of zx spectrums lol , and been under the bonnet of cars for over 30 years  Tongue.

the problem is , people ask things , and get shit replies , then go away and never come back , we all need to start somewere , and if no one ever asked anthing on here the place would be dead .

jim
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nyet
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« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2013, 09:00:16 PM »

jim trust me, I understand what you are saying 100%
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Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your experience.
k0mpresd
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« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2013, 09:14:07 PM »

i think i just hit a nerve. Smiley
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nyet
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« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2013, 09:18:04 PM »

definitely. this topic never fails to rile me...

not to mention any comparison to az.
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ME7.1 tuning guide (READ FIRST)
ECUx Plot
ME7Sum checksum checker/corrrector for ME7.x

Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your experience.
k0mpresd
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« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2013, 09:21:48 PM »

for fwiw, your site that i found long long ago was a gold mine of information.
ive learned tons from the information shared here.
maybe im just jaded. maybe its the fact that people with blinders over their eyes look at some others like they are gods gift to the tuning world when me, along with others, are who put them where they are. it gets a little tough to swallow.
and thats not me being big headed. thats me speaking from personal interactions with a few.
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ddillenger
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« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2013, 09:36:05 PM »

I think we need to make a distinction between the new members that don't want to put in any effort, and the new members who genuinely need a helping hand. To put it bluntly some of the guys here are intimidating (to say the least). I help out whenever I can, but I can certainly understand those that are hesitant to do so. I think it's a 2 part problem-older members are reluctant to pass on information they had to work so hard to attain. Newer members don't seem to understand why every question asked is given a short response.

It irritates me when I try to help someone and it's obvious they don't pay attention or take any initiative and act ungrateful. Is the information I give going to be used commercially? Passed off as their own? Who knows. In the end I guess it really doesn't matter. I'm not going to let a few people dictate my actions, but ultimately it's your decision. I for one love the forum, and think additional rules would be detrimental. I do like the rating system, gives me an idea of the kind of person I'm talking to.
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