Tony@NefMoto
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« on: September 28, 2009, 02:43:53 PM »
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I had some time to inspect a few different data cables. Here is some of what I found. I will try to add more information later if people are interested.
Ross-Tech HEX-CAN-USB:
This is an intelligent interface, meaning that the cable has a micro-controller in it that handles a lot of the low level VAG protocols. The cable can be configured to default to intelligent mode or dumb mode. In dumb mode the cable will transmit any data sent to it, but in intelligent mode you need to known Ross-Tech proprietary protocol to transmit data over the cable. The USB interface is provided by an FTDI 232R USB to RS232 chip.
If you have trouble communicating over this cable with your software, it is most likely because the cable is in intelligent mode. Running the latest version of VCDS will allow you to change the cable settings for it to default to a dumb cable.
KWP2000Plus:
This is an intelligent interface that has an AVR Atmel micro-controller inside it. This interface does not transmit data sent to it, so it must require a proprietary KWP2000Plus protocol in order to send and receive messages. This interface uses an FTDI 232BL USB to RS232 chip to provide the USB interface.
Galletto:
As far as I can tell this is a dumb interface since there are no micro-controllers inside it, but I have not been able to get it to work for sending raw data. I assume that there is some simple circuit preventing me from sending raw data, but I have not had time to figure it out yet. The USB interface is provided by an FTDI 232R USB to RS232 chip.
VAG 409 KKL:
These cables are as dumb as an interface can get. They have minimal circuitry inside them, and are available in RS232 and USB versions. The USB versions I have inspected have their USB interface provided by an FTDI FT232/245BM USB to RS232 chip. The USB cables should work with any software using a com port buy using a virtual com port driver. If software is written to use an FTDI based dumb cable then these cables will also work.
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« Last Edit: October 09, 2009, 06:23:23 PM by Tony@NefMoto »
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fallout
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« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2009, 02:20:28 PM »
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Great info, couple of questions: Can R/T HEX-CAN-USB be used to flash ecu's? If so, with which software? What is the best / fastest setup for flashing? Also, in general, it would be great if you could add which cables work best with which software (or for which functions, diag, flashing, etc), and then just delete my post.  Thanks! |
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Tony@NefMoto
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« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2009, 03:13:33 PM »
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As far as I know, KWP2000Plus will only work with their cable, Galletto will only work with their cable. The software I am writing will work with any dumb cable using an FTDI USB chip. Which means the VAG 409 KKL cable and the Ross-Tech HEX-CAN-USB cable in dumb mode. As for the fastest flashing speed, that is one of the next things I am going to post. But lets just say that currently my software is way way way way faster than KWP2000Plus and Galletto.  |
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robin
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« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2009, 05:17:47 PM »
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Well I'm excited to see what you have cooking  |
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thenextdon13
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« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2009, 10:45:30 PM »
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Tony-
What model was the Galletto cable? 1250 or 1260?
thanks...
Camden
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Tony@NefMoto
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« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2009, 10:09:16 AM »
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I tried out the Galletto 1250 from eBay. Tony-
What model was the Galletto cable? 1250 or 1260?
thanks...
Camden
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thenextdon13
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« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2009, 12:07:03 PM »
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Okay, Thanks Tony.
Are there any other cables you would be interested in testing/having on hand? I have a Ross-tech cable, but would be willing to purchase another cable for testing purposes...
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Tony@NefMoto
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« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2009, 02:20:28 PM »
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Okay, Thanks Tony.
Are there any other cables you would be interested in testing/having on hand? I have a Ross-tech cable, but would be willing to purchase another cable for testing purposes...
There aren't any other cables I can think of testing. The plan at the moment is to just support dumb cables using FTDI usb chips, which there are a ton of. Each intelligent cable would require a different protocol to support it. It would be nice in the future to support ELM based intelligent cables since those are a standard, but I would assume people would be more interested in advanced tuning features then support for specific cable types. |
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thenextdon13
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« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2009, 02:56:56 PM »
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Fair enough, absolutely understood and agreed.
If the FTDI usb chips are that common (it seems they are in practically all of the cables out there from your list), I won't bother.
Something to watch for in the future is the phase out of that chip and the products that use it-- it appears the Galletto 1250 is phasing out for the Galletto 1260 by looking at number of auctions on ebay...
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thenextdon13
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« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2009, 03:15:36 PM »
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Do you happen to have the model number of the FTDI USB chip that you refer to here? I will insert in documentation....
c
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Jason
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Breaks everything!
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« Reply #10 on: October 09, 2009, 05:54:06 PM »
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These are the two VID/PID strings I've personally seen for the USB cables: %VID_0403&PID_FA24.DeviceDesc%=FtdiPort232,FTDIBUS\COMPORT&VID_0403&PID_FA24 %VID_0403&PID_6010.DeviceDesc%=FtdiPort2232,FTDIBUS\COMPORT&VID_0403&PID_6010 A long time ago I edited the INF in the FTDI driver to allow you to install the drivers and expose a COM port with the ross-tech USB cables (I needed this for lemmiwinks) http://www.trumpio.com/usblemmi.zip |
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Tony@NefMoto
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« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2009, 06:24:44 PM »
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Do you happen to have the model number of the FTDI USB chip that you refer to here? I will insert in documentation....
c
I updated the first post with the specific FTDI chip types. Any FTDI 232 chip should work, but I prefer the FTDI 232R since it supports some extra features. |
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thenextdon13
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« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2009, 08:12:24 PM »
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Cool, thanks |
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skele4door
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« Reply #13 on: October 11, 2009, 10:33:31 AM »
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Hey Tony I've got a Galetto 1260 interface. If you want me to send it to you to test with I'd be happy to. Just shoot me a message with your addy if you want to.
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« Last Edit: October 13, 2009, 01:58:19 PM by Tony@NefMoto »
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Tony@NefMoto
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« Reply #14 on: October 13, 2009, 01:58:28 PM »
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Hey Tony I've got a Galetto 1260 interface. If you want me to send it to you to test with I'd be happy to. Just shoot me a message with your addy if you want to.
Cool, thanks for the offer. I might take you up on it a little later once I have had time to release my basic flashing software. |
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