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TTQS
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« Reply #15 on: March 08, 2011, 05:28:18 PM »
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O.k., but I want to see what the reviewer has to say first. Significant revision to the technical content might be required.
Also, even though I have illustrated, edited and augmented the S4 wiki, it was intended to give TT Mk1 owners a flavour of which maps are important and which are changed by tuners. It's not structured or written as a 'how to' as such. I have a pretty basic flow chart which sort of summarises the funktionsrahmen modules a tuner might consider reviewing.
TTQS
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« Last Edit: October 22, 2011, 02:47:40 AM by TTQS »
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Tony@NefMoto
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2001.5 Audi S4 Stage 3
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« Reply #16 on: March 15, 2011, 07:01:09 PM »
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Please post it here whenever you are comfortable. I am sure there are lots of people here willing to give feedback.
If you would like private feedback prior to publishing, I am sure anyone on the forum, myself included would love to help critique it.
All ME7 tuning should be about 70% the same I would say, depending on what sensors and actuators the specific engine has. Ultimately at the end of the day, ME7 is based on controlling load, and so we are all tuning load control matter which ME7 engine it is.
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TTQS
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« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2011, 05:12:35 AM »
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Hi Tony.
My reviewer has not come back to me with any detailed comments so I presume his initial response was all I'm getting.
I have left the TT Forum now but still have an interest in making some of this content available. I'll PM you the link to the file Tony if you want to have a look at it. Perhaps between a few of us, we can knock it into better shape as a how to?
Regards.
TTQS
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« Last Edit: October 22, 2011, 02:47:48 AM by TTQS »
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nyet
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« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2011, 10:22:23 AM »
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Perhaps between a few of us, we can knock it into better shape as a how to?
This sort of thing is precisely what a wiki is good for. Sending a word document back and forth between 3 or more people is almost never productive.. |
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TTQS
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« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2011, 12:36:17 PM »
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Can't argue with that. Well, here goes nothing. [Links now replaced with attachments]. Comments welcome, but please don't savage it because it was conceived as a very basic guide for non-tuning types to get a handle on the topic (and, as I said, is based heavily on the S4 wiki) anyway. I had prepared all the material into forum free text format (many hours spent using Excel macros, etc. to format the tables) so it could be posted up once reviewed and edited. The main document at Revision 1 (23rd September 2011)Understanding ECU Remapping The Audi TT 1.8T Variants - Bosch Motronic ME7.x (Rev 1).pdf (1.09 Mb). Supporting information in MS Excel 2003 workbook:Attached to post ECU Files:Audi TT 1.8T ARY 180 PS 8N0 906 018 BR 0261206439. Audi TT 1.8T BAM 225 PS 8N0 906 018 CB.OLS Audi TT 1.8T BFV 240 PS 8N0 906 018 CA 0261208086 375111.bin Attached to post. Translated funktionsrahmen modulesAny funktionsrahmen modules I have translated manually are on the Nefmoto wiki and on this stickied thread: http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php/topic,555.0title,.htmlTTQS |
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« Last Edit: December 28, 2011, 08:30:52 AM by TTQS »
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nyet
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« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2011, 01:42:56 PM »
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A truly outstanding document! Really, a fine job distilling information. based heavily on the S4 wiki
I don't mind people using the s4 wiki as a reference, but in return, I'd love more active participation in refining the s4 wiki ONSITE  |
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carlossus
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Leon Curpa Stg1+
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« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2011, 02:07:51 PM »
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Thank you TTQS, this is a massive leg up for me. your opening paragraph sums up why I'm here I think.
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nyet
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« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2011, 02:09:24 PM »
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Just finished reading! A truly staggeringly awesome document! One (very minor) comment though on something that stood out. Maximum requested boost [can be set] slightly above the maximum MAP (presumably to account for pressure drop across the charge air coolers between the turbocharger and intake manifold).
I am convinced this is an unintentional "bug" in ME7. I can't think of a single good reason why you should EVER let the set point be over the heighest possible measurement.. Undesirable effects can occur in control loops if the MV cannot meet the DV A dramatic understatement |
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TTQS
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« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2011, 03:51:01 PM »
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O.k. guys, thanks for the comments. It will be interesting to see how we progress from here.
I accept the comments regarding the S4 wiki, but I am not sufficiently knowledgeable or experienced to modify or contribute to that body of knowledge. Not at least without a collaborative effort.
Just to illustrate the gulf between amateur tuning and professional ECU calibrators, the person I originally sent it to commented:
"There are many errors which will be too time consuming to correct".
The tuning for their company is done by a third party to their specification he tells me, but he himself has a very good working knowledge of Bosch Motronic tuning... You see why I was disheartened?
Regards.
TTQS
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« Last Edit: October 22, 2011, 02:48:28 AM by TTQS »
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nyet
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« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2011, 04:03:54 PM »
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The tuning for their company is done by a third party to their specification he tells me, but he himself has a very good working knowledge of Bosch Motronic tuning... You see why I was disheartened?
Yup. This is why (non-bosch) professionals are useless in the current ME culture. Their shit doesn't stink, they don't have "time" to help you, you are "too stupid" to do it yourself, and you are "stealing" from them. None of them have *ever* actually TRIED to write a document, from scratch, that others can read and learn from. They may have a million little factoids in their head, but absolutely no ability to convey it usefully to anybody else. I understand your pain... which is why I'm saying... GREAT JOB. Obviously it has mistakes and outright falsehoods.. I know for a fact s4wiki does, but it is the best I could do with what I've got. As I find the problems, I try to correct them, but I can't think of a single instance where a "knowledgeable" person has actually tried to help in any real way other than "you're wrong. I can't tell you why, its a secret" or "its too complicated". I am just glad somebody other than me has tried to write such a document! |
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TTQS
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« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2011, 04:23:26 PM »
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O.k. Thanks. Comforting words actually. I accumulated over 2,000 posts in about two years on the TT Forum but ultimately resigned due to work and family commitments. It was a bit of a shame that I felt the need to do that before publishing this effort, but hey. So it goes. This forum seems pretty good so far. Not as many members and leechers which can only be a good thing. It would be a bit hypocritical to resign from one forum and then start haunting another though!  I guess I have to watch what I say because before I approached the pro tuner to have a look at this article, he caught up with me asking questions while researching on www.chiptuners.org. It was always going to be a big ask for him to help me out though, but yes Nyet, I share many of your sentiments.  I mean, if they tell us how EGT regulation works, do they think that anyone with a funktionsrahmen, a KWP2000 suite and a laptop will wake up the next morning a brilliant professional tuner? I think not. I could, of course, have simply flashed off the commercial remap from my ECU and used that as a basis for the analysis and I probably would have made better progress. But I didn't because I have some integrity and the work is probably worse off for it. TTQS |
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« Last Edit: October 22, 2011, 02:48:54 AM by TTQS »
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msundercober
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« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2011, 05:14:11 PM »
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i will work through your document in the next days .. as my native language is german it will take a bit longer for me.
All i can say is you got my full respect on doing such a document.
But you have to understand professional tuners too.
They pay about 100.000 € to learn how to remap ...
So just hope it won´t come into the wrong hands and no ebaysuccker will sell it
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« Last Edit: March 16, 2011, 05:16:09 PM by msundercober »
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nyet
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« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2011, 05:54:55 PM »
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So just hope it won't come into the wrong hands and no ebaysuccker will sell it A freely available document has an ebay value of 0. Nobody sells RFCs. |
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Tony@NefMoto
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« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2011, 07:07:16 PM »
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I am working my way through the document and adding comments. It is slow going though when I have to write a comment on every paragraph. No bad comments, just pointing out areas where the discussion is too vague. Great work so far with what I have read.
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TTQS
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« Reply #29 on: March 17, 2011, 01:41:01 AM »
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I am working my way through the document and adding comments. It is slow going though when I have to write a comment on every paragraph. No bad comments, just pointing out areas where the discussion is too vague. Great work so far with what I have read.
Hi Tony. That sounds encouraging. You're probably giving it the level of attention I expected and needed from the first reviewer. If you all want to feed back comments to me (PM me and I'll send you my e-mail address to which you can e-mail a marked up version), the best way forward might be for me to revise it based on Tony's suggestions and others areas of commonality then republish it as Draft 3. That could be a few weeks away but I'll do my best. Once most people are satisfied and/or have contributed their own material, I will transfer it to forum free text for publication here. No reason why the S4 wiki can't be updated in parallel either I guess. If anyone has fully-defined .OLS files for other Motronic ME7.x equipped vehicles like the 225 BAM one I have been using, I'm sure it would be helpful to bring those under this umbrella too. I obtained some files in a VAG set while researching the article, but obviously I only needed the Audi TT 8N ones. Four (including the 1.8T BAM 225PS file in my supporting information) are posted up here: http://www.nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=467.0title=BTW. I used to be a technical author working on nuclear industry safety cases, so I'm used to technical documents bouncing back and forth between verifiers and independent safety assessors. TTQS |
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« Last Edit: October 22, 2011, 02:50:02 AM by TTQS »
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