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Author Topic: edc15 diesel tuning  (Read 19675 times)
prj
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« Reply #15 on: July 01, 2015, 02:17:41 PM »

Easy to tell somebody doesn't know anything without having anything to say.

The 3 Diesel engines I drove had maxed out stock injection without maxing out the turbos.
In this case (alh) it is the same. First you will max out the injectors then turbo then the injection pump itself.

Yes, it's easy to say, because what you are saying is incorrect. For 99.9% of the engines.
ALH is the same, you can have black smoke on stock injectors and stock turbo. AFN too.

so BTT:
1: stock ecu is shooting very lean like 22-19:1, you should shoot for about 15:1, just go richer till you see smoke. how much smoke is oke for you u have to decide on your own.
Lambda 1.03 on diesel = huge black smoke and molten pistons.

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2.there is a problem if injection timing is too long. a lot of fuel will then be burned while the piston is going down -> will generate lot of smoke and heat but very low power gain. to know how long your injection is and how much after top dead center you calculate, Start of Injection + time of injection = End of injection. e.g. -11°SOI (negative because BTDC) +20°=9°ATDC EOI.
This only applies to CR and PD engines. There is no "duration" calibration as such in VP pumps. Only pump voltage output, which adjusts the main metering valve in the pump (which in the end adjusts duration, but this is purely mechanical) - You are not going to calculate anything on a rotary pump.

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What you will expirience if u add fuel without modding the boost map or the n75 is that you will have very high aggressive boost peaks on low rpm. this results in edc15 taking fuel out of the running engine to get the boost back under control
It NEVER does that. The only time you are going to have any fuel cut is when you are in limp mode from endless overboost. The ECU does not control boost by fueling period.

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Also spooling the turbo up too fast will harm the turbo.
No, it won't unless you hit compressor surge, which you almost never do on a diesel.

Lots of misinformation in this thread.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2015, 02:20:35 PM by prj » Logged

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eibxmatic
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« Reply #16 on: July 01, 2015, 03:11:04 PM »

@prj

Sure u can have black smoke with eBay tuning. Giving too much fuel before I have Boost. Also if u mess up injection timing.

15 could be too right rich, told that in my first post that Iam not sure anymore what the low smoke big power afr was.

Applys also on vp44. Worked a lot with vp44. Calculating with test drive csv will give u CR timing. Agree that there is no table with CR on fueling. Vp44/37 will calc or apply (doesn't matter how u want to call it) it itself.


Much more fuel without recalculating boost map and n75 DC will give u massive boost peak and a lot of overboost. Vp44 gave me fuel cut in that condition(bad remap).

You are able to spool  vtg turbos too fast  because of how the vtg is working.
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eibxmatic
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« Reply #17 on: July 01, 2015, 03:27:17 PM »

Before u say anything against again. Engine won't cut fuel because of high boost. But engine wants to keep boost on table levels. So if u have maf readings of let's say 800mg/stroke of airmass. Then "boost control" kicks in and lowers boost(won't happen with 100mbar but with 300mbar) then what will happen to your maf readings ? Where will you go to on smoke map ? What will happen to iq then ?
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prj
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« Reply #18 on: July 01, 2015, 11:39:33 PM »

@prj

Sure u can have black smoke with eBay tuning. Giving too much fuel before I have Boost. Also if u mess up injection timing.
No, the turbo is done before the injectors are done. Maybe you need to learn how to tune correctly.
If your only experience is VP44, then the injectors are NOT done on VP44, there is an IQ limiter in the pump. It's the only exception there is, as it's basically impossible to make a 2.5 TDI "hitlers revenge for WWII" V6 smoke due to said limiter.
No such issues on VP37.

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Applys also on vp44. Worked a lot with vp44. Calculating with test drive csv will give u CR timing. Agree that there is no table with CR on fueling. Vp44/37 will calc or apply (doesn't matter how u want to call it) it itself.
VP44 you don't have even a pump voltage table, as it's in the pump. So does not matter what you do with it, it's not important. VP44 has an IQ limiter LONG before EOI even becomes a problem, and if you fit bigger injectors you can throw all those calculations out of the window.
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Much more fuel without recalculating boost map and n75 DC will give u massive boost peak and a lot of overboost. Vp44 gave me fuel cut in that condition(bad remap).
VP44 does not cut anything, ECU goes to limp mode if you overboost more than a certain amount for more than a certain time. Read the FR.
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You are able to spool  vtg turbos too fast  because of how the vtg is working.
Bullshit.

Before u say anything against again. Engine won't cut fuel because of high boost. But engine wants to keep boost on table levels. So if u have maf readings of let's say 800mg/stroke of airmass. Then "boost control" kicks in and lowers boost(won't happen with 100mbar but with 300mbar) then what will happen to your maf readings ? Where will you go to on smoke map ? What will happen to iq then ?
If you are running on WOT so that smoke limiter is limiting your IQ due to boost fluctuations you know NOTHING about diesel tuning. It should not use the smoke limiter on WOT in the area where there can be boost fluctuations. EVER. This is the first most basic rule of tuning diesel. Every single car is calibrated with this rule in mind from factory for obvious reasons.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2015, 11:46:09 PM by prj » Logged

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ktm733
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« Reply #19 on: July 02, 2015, 07:00:36 AM »

alread after getting back to being confused can we straighten a few things out?
1: What AFR should I be shooting for on a WOT pull?
2: how do we know how to tune injectors to open earlier for more fuel? Simply guessing is something I don't like to do haha
Let's lighten the mood in this post.
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ktm733
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« Reply #20 on: July 02, 2015, 10:27:46 AM »

hold that thought! i found this pdf that explains there is a map that already knows the calculation for a certain amount of fuel. I guess it's called duration map and there might be like 4 of them. So why modify this map s it already knows how much time it takes to inject this amount of fuel unless it doesn't reach the limits we are asking for?
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ktm733
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« Reply #21 on: July 02, 2015, 10:59:26 AM »

Can somebody explain on page 25 when altering boost they did edit the axis to 70mg and instead did 60?
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