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Author Topic: 1.8T 20vt Injectors  (Read 72989 times)
Awaken
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« Reply #150 on: September 06, 2022, 12:36:15 AM »

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« Last Edit: September 06, 2022, 01:47:18 AM by Awaken » Logged
Awaken
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« Reply #151 on: September 06, 2022, 01:47:06 AM »

You keep asking what EGT.
VAG runs 980C continuous at the turbine with the stock engine. It's in the ECU.
0.9 and then fuel dump closed loop to not go past 980C.

Thanks! The question was more towards setups with BTs, but this is also helpful.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2022, 04:16:55 AM by Awaken » Logged
blairl
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« Reply #152 on: September 06, 2022, 12:05:57 PM »

I put my words in here so that other people who might hit this thread see how not to tune.

I learned a lot in here, thank you. 
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LAMFAWKR, did anyone else find this variable funny?
nyet
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« Reply #153 on: September 06, 2022, 12:31:48 PM »

Note that in the US, doing a full WOT 1 mile+ pull is rare except on road courses (and even then, they're rare - the longest straights don't go that far, and nobody HPDEs on an oval). So it isn't surprising you see both hail mary pulls and hail mary tunes that really only are subjected to 10 sec WOT at a time at the extreme end.

Water meth solutions also don't last long on track, you have to bring way too much meth with you on track day.

Most of us run race gas and race gas tunes when tracking for this reason.

By and large, high hp chasing dyno queens almost never run pump gas either - you'll never get anyone to be willing to "compete" using pump gas. It just doesn't happen.
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ME7.1 tuning guide (READ FIRST)
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Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your experience.
prj
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« Reply #154 on: September 06, 2022, 01:20:58 PM »

There's also Autobahns in Germany and there are chances your client can go there.
In German they call it "Vollgasfest". And it is a good philosophy to apply to tuning.

I've tuned a strong four digits of cars and I can count engine failures on my fingers, and only 1 or 2 where it could be argued that it was tuning related rather than hardware issues.
And that's with many of them subjected to the 30 seconds of WOT described above.
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nyet
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« Reply #155 on: September 06, 2022, 04:01:38 PM »

There's also Autobahns in Germany and there are chances your client can go there.
In German they call it "Vollgasfest". And it is a good philosophy to apply to tuning.

I've tuned a strong four digits of cars and I can count engine failures on my fingers, and only 1 or 2 where it could be argued that it was tuning related rather than hardware issues.
And that's with many of them subjected to the 30 seconds of WOT described above.

Understood. Just saying, most tuners are willing to hand off grenades to their clients to win HP dick waving contests, knowing (or assuming) the client won't do anything but street light racing and 3/4 gear pulls on the freeway
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ME7.1 tuning guide (READ FIRST)
ECUx Plot
ME7Sum checksum checker/corrrector for ME7.x

Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your experience.
Awaken
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« Reply #156 on: September 06, 2022, 09:46:28 PM »

Understood. Just saying, most tuners are willing to hand off grenades to their clients to win HP dick waving contests, knowing (or assuming) the client won't do anything but street light racing and 3/4 gear pulls on the freeway

Most tuners have to do it because of clientele. If your 1.9TDI gets beaten by your buddy's 1.9TDI, your tuner's ass's going to itch from all the cursing. Cheesy

That aside, there's always ways to get best of both worlds (given the situation): boost controllers, map switching. Using MDBGRGA and KFMDBGRG to limit torque on high gear is a good option, most highway and long time WOT is done on highest gear anyway, so no need to torture the car there, but still good for 3rd/4th pulls. Flooring it for a mile won't really be a problem.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2022, 10:07:23 PM by Awaken » Logged
prj
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« Reply #157 on: September 07, 2022, 02:42:16 AM »

Most tuners have to do it because of clientele. If your 1.9TDI gets beaten by your buddy's 1.9TDI, your tuner's ass's going to itch from all the cursing. Cheesy
No, it is done because of lack of knowledge and doing a shit job.
On Diesel you only have to set a reasonable EGT and IAT limit, that's all there is to it. And by setting correct EOI (most diesel tuners don't even know what that means), you will have better performance everywhere and lower EGT.

Correctly tuned there will not be any difference between the cars performance.
Except one will blow up in extreme conditions and the other one will limit the output at that point and stay together.

This thinking that somehow you need a tune for power, economy etc is complete bullshit done to sell more of the same shit.
ECU has full 3D mapping. ME7 has ways to limit requested load during too much knock intervention/low ignition efficiency and the 1.8T variant even has real closed loop EGT control.
The only excuse for having non-fullthrottle safe tunes is laziness and ignorance, which this thread reeks of.
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nyet
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« Reply #158 on: September 07, 2022, 10:50:23 AM »

This thinking that somehow you need a tune for power, economy etc is complete bullshit done to sell more of the same shit.
ECU has full 3D mapping. ME7 has ways to limit requested load during too much knock intervention/low ignition efficiency and the 1.8T variant even has real closed loop EGT control.
The only excuse for having non-fullthrottle safe tunes is laziness and ignorance, which this thread reeks of.

Agree. I didn't mean to imply safe tuning imposes performance limits. Safe tuning just requires knowledge/effort.
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ME7.1 tuning guide (READ FIRST)
ECUx Plot
ME7Sum checksum checker/corrrector for ME7.x

Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your experience.
Blazius
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« Reply #159 on: September 07, 2022, 02:10:44 PM »

Note that in the US, doing a full WOT 1 mile+ pull is rare except on road courses (and even then, they're rare - the longest straights don't go that far, and nobody HPDEs on an oval). So it isn't surprising you see both hail mary pulls and hail mary tunes that really only are subjected to 10 sec WOT at a time at the extreme end.

Water meth solutions also don't last long on track, you have to bring way too much meth with you on track day.

Most of us run race gas and race gas tunes when tracking for this reason.

By and large, high hp chasing dyno queens almost never run pump gas either - you'll never get anyone to be willing to "compete" using pump gas. It just doesn't happen.

But see that still does not explain or excuse the high CR stock motors and pump fuel, because if you put the same car with same boost same everything but with lower CR and 10 more degrees of timing at peak torque and so on, which one is likelier to 'win' ? Smiley

If that was the way Audi wouldve kept 9.5 CR on the higher HP models too, just boost increase and turbo change.
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