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Author Topic: 1.8T engine is running too rich - Long Term Fuel Trim -19% please help :(  (Read 86587 times)
Carsinc
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I was wondering if the file requires larger injectors and someone put stock back in before they sold the car to him.

like 225 injectors, I also wonder if it has a 225 maf in a regular housing?
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userpike
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like 225 injectors, I also wonder if it has a 225 maf in a regular housing?

Just looked again at the vid of him testing the injectors. Those look like 225 injectors with the long stem!
He has the 180hp model so it makes sense for the trims in the negative if the maps weren't changed for the bigger injectors.


He changed the whole MAF twice with OEM replacements.

time to check part numbers on some injectors.. Undecided
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Carsinc
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That car should have the long noozle, EV12 injectors bosch num. 0 280 155 897, But there not blue and most 225 cars have blue injectors stock.
I still want to know what part number maf was used?
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TCSTigersClaw
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Yes! MAF reads half the airflow -> tell to ECU to inject half times -> leaner AFR -> O2 reads leaner than 14.7 -> O2 controler add fuel to hit the lambda = 1 target -> STFT = positive
It is classic if you see 20-25% and it still misfire in idle Tongue

Yes you are right! I got it backwards..Thank you a lot Revlimit !
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VAG cars newbie tuner Smiley
Malinovsky
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OK people time to make some update

You can drive without the MAF indefinitely. The ecu uses a calculated value sans the MAF signal.
I did test runs with unplugged MAF.
the procedure was like this: I reset ecu and trims. Then I unplugged maf and did a test drive with vag-com.
LTFT gave me great values near 0%. But during this test ride my STFT was showing me 0% for all the time  Roll Eyes
After test I checked errors and got 2. First about MAF - so it's ok cause it was unplugged Wink and second with info that the car couldn't do Throttle body adaptation.
So I did a test again, but I changed the procedure a little.
I plugged MAF, then reset ecu and trims again THEN I did TB adaptation in block 060 and after that I unplugged maf for another test drive. Values were the same. Near 0% in LTFT and permanent 0% in STFT during whole drive.
After test I got only MAF error in ecu memory.
Then I plugged MAF, reset ecu and trims, did throttle body adaptation and did a test drive with plugged MAF. I got -18% LTFT after a few minutes of drive, and STFT was working and moving up and down the whole drive time.
What does it mean? I don't know. Maybe something, maybe nothing - you tell me Wink

If it were me, I'd flash a known stock file (yours doesn't look stock, if the car is rated @180hp that's a crank figure, you're showing 179 at the wheels?) and keep the MAF plugged in.
What makes you think that my ecu is not stock? hmm what is wrong with the fact that my stock 180hb car gave 179hp when I checked it on dyno after I bought it? I don't get it Sad I thought it looks like it should  Undecided

Verify it's the correct MAF (not just the housing, remove the sensor and verify THAT is correct). I don't think your trims are due to a leak.
Like I wrote before. I bought 2 factory new maf's for my car. I checked Maf number in AUDI ETKA part system with my VIN number. System shows that my car OEM MAF NUMBER is: 06A 906 461 D and this is the number that was on maf that I removed from my car. I bought a new bosh MAF with number 0 280 218 032 so this is the same part that should be in my car.
I bought it new and sealed and put in my car. I didn't open it to check sensor number but since it is a new product the sensor must be correct. To be 100% sure I will open maf tomorror and write you sensor number that is inside.

I was wondering if the file requires larger injectors
 
is it possible to check this option? I mean can I or someone from forum check my ecu file if it is stock or not?
Or maybe I can do some logs that will show if this isn't ecu for my stock 320 injectors ?

I'd bet thats a tuned file, that surging is classic for poor tune.  I say leave everything the way it is and flash a known stock
file.
Like I said surge was there bacause of old and damaged OEM DV, after I replace dv surge was gone.
I don't have any other stock 180 hp TT ecu then mine on the car :/ Sad

I also wonder if it has a 225 maf in a regular housing?
not possible since I bought a factory new maf for my car

Just looked again at the vid of him testing the injectors. Those look like 225 injectors with the long stem!
He has the 180hp model so it makes sense for the trims in the negative if the maps weren't changed for the bigger injectors.

time to check part numbers on some injectors.. Undecided

I have stock ajq injectors. In fact I even had all 4 in hands to check resistance.
Part number from my injectors:
06a 906 031s

I also tried to do o2 sensor tests from this link I got in this topic.
I could only start the test procedure from block 030.
and then I couldn't continue cause I don't have needed blocks.
blocks like 034 , 036, 037, 043 and so on are not working on my system :/

Tomorrow I will also check 'hockey puck' valve - I will simply swap it to other one from TT with good trims values.

And LAST BUT NOT LEAST
many or you are also looking on my dyno graph here to get some ideas of my problem cause.
Like I said this is an old graph from days when I bought the car. I just add it to show that car was stock duo to showing car's hp on graph.
If it can help to look into my car and my car's ecu I'm adding my current graph.
This is the same car, with the same ecu + a few of mods I mentioned before:
forge TIP, forge 007 dv with cold side relo mod, FMIC with garrett core and forge valves, blueflame Catback exhaust, amsoil air filter
now you are free to comment my graph as much as you like Cheesy Wink





« Last Edit: July 03, 2013, 03:22:35 PM by Malinovsky » Logged
ddillenger
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Pull your ecu file and post it. I will look at it immediately.
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Malinovsky
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Pull your ecu file and post it. I will look at it immediately.
ecu in .bin  file in attachment
my ecu number is 8L0 906 018 J
car: audi tt 180hp quattro, ajq engine, year 2000
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ddillenger
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Stock file.
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Malinovsky
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thanks
so looks like not many options left  Angry
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Carsinc
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Stock file.
Thank you, and now I'm back to the hockey puck as my final choice.
Just plug the puck and run the catch can open so I can know. Grin
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Malinovsky
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and run the catch can open so I can know. Grin
what do you mena by this ?  Roll Eyes
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Carsinc
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what do you mena by this ?  Roll Eyes
Where the hose goes to the hockey puck from the catch can just take it off and plug the puck, or
take the puck out of the intake pipe and plug the intake, I think the first way is better. This is not a long term
thing just long enough for the fuel trim to change.
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userpike
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Where the hose goes to the hockey puck from the catch can just take it off and plug the puck, or
take the puck out of the intake pipe and plug the intake, I think the first way is better. This is not a long term
thing just long enough for the fuel trim to change.

you'd be better off testing the system with an elbow to replace the hockey puck if you think you have to do it that way. In that case, If there is no change in the fuel trim then you know what's up. The way I explained to test for the hockey puck itself is way easier and quicker. If the hockey puck is still good then the fuel trim issue is elsewhere. The way it seems you explain it the crankcase would pressurize on boost.

I'm thinking he will find his hockey puck to be fine unless its the original. Mine was filthy when I checked it out before replacement. I also think that because he removed the line connecting the intake manifold to the PCV system, including a check valve in the process,(even though the port in the intake is plugged) might have something to do with the issue here. The hockey puck part was designed to work with a certain amount of vacuum/pressure during operation, with the connection removed between the intake and PCV maybe the pressure/vacuum difference from stock is enough to throw off the hockey puck's regulatory performance. But maybe not because the purpose of the checkvalve between the intake and PCV is to close when the intake is pressurized.
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Malinovsky
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Okay people I'm back.
I did the easiest move to check hockey puck theory - I bought a new one from Audi.


on the right - the old valve (034 129 101a), and on the left a new one - factory new (034 129 101b)


I'm thinking he will find his hockey puck to be fine unless its the original
unfortunately userpike was right - new part didn't solve the problem Sad

I also think that because he removed the line connecting the intake manifold to the PCV system, including a check valve in the process,(even though the port in the intake is plugged) might have something to do with the issue here.
like I wrote before - I have this problem since engine was 100% stock. I removed pcv system AFTER the problem appeared, so I'm sure that this is not the right track.

ANYONE any other ideas or opinions?
I'm adding csv log made in me7 so you can download it and check in ECUxPlot
+ this is the link with converted values from csv log :
http://vaglog.rtnet.pl/soulx666_135866.html

damn I'm starting to lose hope. The new turbo is on the way and I won't be able to swap it till I solve this trim problem
« Last Edit: July 21, 2013, 09:25:39 AM by Malinovsky » Logged
ddillenger
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Injector and MAF part numbers would help.
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