Bosch EV6 TVUB

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nyet

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #60 on: March 20, 2020, 07:54:09 PM »

Quote from: lepatron972 on March 20, 2020, 09:22:15 AM

Injector voltage offset as a function of battery voltage it's written at the bottom of the page

The units are still ms, not V though which means OFFCOMP scales OFFSET in ms.

"OFFCOMP multiplier on OFFSET"

Bat Voltage (v) -> OFFSET -> latency (ms) scaled by OFFCOMP -> TVUB (ms)

The entire thing is a scheduled slope/offset correction, with additive and multpilicative corrections, which are all scheduled by pressure

slopeHI, slopeLOW are multiplicative corrections are all functions of p, scheduled by crossover point fuel mass m
k0 = f0(p)
k1 = f1(p)

offset is a additive correction and also a function of p:

off = foff(p)

so time(ms) = kn(ms/v) * batt(v) + off(ms)

where kn is selected dependent on m


« Last Edit: March 20, 2020, 08:06:40 PM by nyet »	Logged

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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #61 on: March 21, 2020, 01:00:39 AM »

Quote from: nyet on March 20, 2020, 07:54:09 PM

I said a nonsense at the beginning the dead time does not change because it is the time before total opening of the injector that is why in principle the pressure does not influence it

6.1 Battery correction (Batcor) or (TUVB)

The time required for the mechanical opening of the injector increases when the battery voltage decreases. The Zinj represents the dead time of the injector under 16V and Batcor ensures its correction up to 8 Volts.

The evolution of the dead time corresponds to the BATCOR correction made on the Ti to obtain the same fuel flow during a battery voltage drop.

For a given wealth R and a fixed regime N.
Ti (8V) = Ti (16V) + Batcor (8V)
Ti (10V) = Ti (16V) + Batcor (10V)
Ti (12V) = Ti (16V) + Batcor (12V)
Ti (14V) = Ti (16V) + Batcor (14V)
Ti (16V) = Ti (16V) + Batcor (16V)

From the documentation on the following page determine:
Batcor (10V) = (1250-357) = 893 ms
Batcor (12V) = (830 - 357) = 473 ms
Batcor (14V) = (500 - 357) = 143 ms
Batcor (16V) = (357-357) = 0 ms

6.2 Minimum guard during the engine period.

The “minimum guard” represents the value for which the difference between the period of the engine and the Ti is the smallest. This value corresponds to the time given to the injector to close.

The generally recommended value is 1 ms for a multipoint and 0.5 ms for a single point. If the Ti is greater than the period, the injector remains continuously open, which makes it impossible to further increase the wealth.

Definition of the maximum Ti: this is the maximum value reached in order to comply with the richness and engine temperature conditions.

This ensures that the injector works in its linear operating zone.

Determine the motor period and then the maximum Ti value from 2000 to 6000 motor.

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nyet

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #62 on: March 21, 2020, 12:35:02 PM »

That doesn't answer how OFFCOMP is used


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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #63 on: March 21, 2020, 01:10:35 PM »

Quote from: nyet on March 21, 2020, 12:35:02 PM

That doesn't answer how OFFCOMP is used

the offcomp function is implemented by the fkkvs map in general except mounting without return circuit it seems to me

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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #64 on: March 21, 2020, 01:13:23 PM »

fkkvs it is a small correction in any case which applies to tvub

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lepatron972

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	Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #65 on: March 21, 2020, 01:15:35 PM »

FKKVS is not very important most important of krkte and TVUB

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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #66 on: March 21, 2020, 01:32:54 PM »

Quote from: lepatron972 on March 21, 2020, 01:15:35 PM

FKKVS is not very important most important of krkte and TVUB

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It is important, look at TT 225 file. Injectors are really not linear, and in low injector time it vary much
I needed to expand x asis for geting fuel trims close to zero. Otherwise it wery too much and it was imposible to get feuling right with those injectors and FKVS from stock A4


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nyet

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #67 on: March 21, 2020, 01:33:42 PM »

Quote from: lepatron972 on March 21, 2020, 01:10:35 PM

the offcomp function is implemented by the fkkvs map in general except mounting without return circuit it seems to me

Not possible, the fkkvs map is not pressure dependent, but offcomp is.

Not only that but it is zero in many files.


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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #68 on: March 21, 2020, 01:43:32 PM »

Quote from: nyet on March 21, 2020, 01:33:42 PM

Not possible, the fkkvs map is not pressure dependent, but offcomp is.

Not only that but it is zero in many files.

FKKVS is a function of the pressure, predefined by measurement as a function of the pressures linked by the axes Ti and rpm, as for direct injections.
Fkkvs is not flat when the pressures or ti are variable.

this is how I understand it, in the docs and thanks to the measurements made for a bit of dev with friends.

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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #69 on: March 21, 2020, 01:48:48 PM »

Quote from: BlackT on March 21, 2020, 01:32:54 PM

yes absolutely, fkkvs compensates for falling just before the final injection. In the file fnwp_offcomp is translated by FKKVS to simplify the operation.

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lepatron972

nyet

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #70 on: March 21, 2020, 03:11:52 PM »

Quote from: lepatron972 on March 21, 2020, 01:48:48 PM

yes absolutely, fkkvs compensates for falling just before the final injection. In the file fnwp_offcomp is translated by FKKVS to simplify the operation.

FKKVS is a multiplicative correction map, not an additive map, unlike TVUB. As far as I know there are no other injector specific additive maps in ME7.

Low load non-linearities are better modeled with an additive map, not a multiplicative map; the effects of OFFCOMP disappear at high loads. Not only that, FKKVS is zero in many stock maps for cars that have conventional return fuel systems.


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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #71 on: March 22, 2020, 02:01:49 AM »

Personally on my personal vehicle certainly French 4 cylinders PSA I work with injectors 330cc under 3,5bars which are mounted on nissan Z350 under 3bars.
With tuvb provided by bosch no modification to apply to the tuvb just krkte to adjust. I went from 147.95g / min to 330g / min and I have no difficulty with petrol or e85. ME7.4.4 or ME7.4.5 ECU same result.

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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #72 on: March 22, 2020, 02:53:07 AM »

The timing correction injector is related to the P delta, not the isolated gasoline pressure, you have several approaches, or you regulate it mechanically with a pressure regulator enslaved to the collector pressure, in which case you don't need to manage it in software, or very little.

Either you make an algorithm that inputs:
-Pressure ramp injection
-Pressure intake
-TUVB
The goal is simple, to guarantee a controlled and manageable delta P.

What impacts the unit flow of your injector is not the input pressure, it is the difference in pressure between the input and the output.

Example:
If you apply 10b in a ramp and spit in a 5b collector, it's like applying 5b in ramp and spitting in the atmosphere.
10b -5b = 5b
5b - 0b = 5b,
the flow is 100% the same.

As a reminder TVUB has nothing to do with pressure, but, with tension.
In multi-point injection, it's ultra easy to understand, you have overall 3 parameters of entry
-1 battery voltage
-2 TEMIN
-3 The Delta P


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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #73 on: April 28, 2020, 03:02:56 AM »

Hi
replaced injector 0 280 155 825 Statistical flow at 3 bar, average n-heptane, 176.7 g / min
per injector 0 280 155 892 Static flow at 3 bar, average n-heptane, 269 g / min from (1.8 t quattro [APX; BAM] 224 hp, S3 quattro [AMK; APY; AUL] 210 l . From)
set FPR to 4 bar.
set the values of TVUB with APX, BAM TT 225
calculated KRKTE FPR 4 bar

car rides well, but at idle pulls
I need help


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lepatron972

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	Re: Bosch EV6 TVUB « Reply #74 on: April 28, 2020, 03:08:07 AM »

Hi,

see if TEMIN is identical between the two files because a too high TEMIN can prevent the regulation of the ti at the idle

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lepatron972

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