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Author Topic: Big turbo IRL/IOP/LDRPLS/KFWDKMSN tuning  (Read 68512 times)
nyet
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« Reply #75 on: June 06, 2014, 02:31:37 PM »

you can KINDA do the same in OLS with the edit function with the % in four corners... flatten the area you want to interpolate, then use the four corner thingy to make a smooth area.
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em.Euro.R18
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« Reply #76 on: September 04, 2014, 12:34:38 PM »

Since noone has posted any visuals yet:

Here is an illustration of the results of properly setting up KFWDKMSN and MSNWDK on a big turbo A4. This car has a 50 trim, S4 throttle body and a very large SEM intake manifold. You can see how far off the calculated value was prior to tuning. If the MAF failed, it certainly would not have driven well.

Before:



After:



I could have spent more time here, but I was satisfied.


How did you log or plot theoretical mass airflow at throttle plate?
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nyet
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« Reply #77 on: September 04, 2014, 12:57:49 PM »


How did you log or plot theoretical mass airflow at throttle plate?

From ME7L m7_alias.map:

msdk_w              , {MassAirFlowAtThrottlePlate}       , {Massenstrom ▒ber Drosselklappe (word)}
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ddillenger
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« Reply #78 on: September 04, 2014, 01:00:31 PM »

What nye said!
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em.Euro.R18
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« Reply #79 on: September 04, 2014, 01:59:51 PM »

I had no idea theoretical could be logged! Now obviously the resolution is limited to map limit. I can't imagine getting them to line up via MSN/WDK. IOP/IRL and possibly some playing around in KFZWIOP/IOP2 ?

Thank you guys as usual!
« Last Edit: September 04, 2014, 02:21:07 PM by em.Euro.R18 » Logged
nyet
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« Reply #80 on: September 04, 2014, 02:31:56 PM »

I had no idea theoretical could be logged! Now obviously the resolution is limited to map limit. I can't imagine getting them to line up via MSN/WDK. IOP/IRL and possibly some playing around in KFZWIOP/IOP2 ?

Thank you guys as usual!

You do not have to touch IOP/IRL or anything other than MSN/WDK..
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nyet
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« Reply #81 on: September 07, 2014, 06:37:38 PM »

From ME7L m7_alias.map:

msdk_w              , {MassAirFlowAtThrottlePlate}       , {Massenstrom ▒ber Drosselklappe (word)}


BTW for the sake of completeness

msndk_w and mshfm_w are not the correct values to compare.
Have a look at BGMSZS and try to understand why.
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prj
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« Reply #82 on: March 15, 2015, 06:30:51 AM »

MSN/WDK is a characteristic of the throttle alone only.
It is the base mass airflow through the throttle plate at a given throttle opening.
It does not matter what turbo you fit on there, it is always going to be nearly the same for a given opening at the same pressure and air temperature in the instances where the throttle is limiting the engine.
And msnwdk is corrected by pressure pre-throttle plate.

The map you need to edit is WDKUGDN, MSN/WDK only need axis extending in some cases.
« Last Edit: March 15, 2015, 06:33:16 AM by prj » Logged
nyet
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« Reply #83 on: November 01, 2015, 04:25:42 PM »

Yes.
Basically it should be <0.95 if the axis is <1

KFVPDKSD/E thread split to separate topic, since it is about throttle plate control, not fast path torque reduction...

http://nefariousmotorsports.com/forum/index.php?topic=9221.0title=
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« Reply #84 on: February 12, 2016, 01:52:52 PM »

Hi there gents,
just wondering if any of you may have an xdf which will make following the settings discussed in this thread a little simpler..? I have recently installed a gt2860 on my b6 1.8t, running around 17psi, pulls great, and have made some map adjustments to improve the performance, but not handy enough yet with xdf editing to make sense of the maps im able to look at.
That or... I'd be happy to compare to a .bin that is mapped for 12-13psi waste gate.
Thanks gents.
Im reading and re-reading this topic to try to increase my understanding... but not sure how to find axis variables described here..
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Jim_Coupe
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« Reply #85 on: March 30, 2016, 07:29:50 AM »

This is how KFWDKMSN and KFWDKSMX looks like in an NA 3.2 VR6 24v BUB..

KFWDKSMX is 99.9985 over the entire map.

KFWDKMSN is ramping up in the beginning and slowly increases. What does this say on spool in a BIG turbo application?
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E85oholic
ddillenger
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« Reply #86 on: March 30, 2016, 08:19:53 AM »

MSN/WDK is a characteristic of the throttle alone only.
It is the base mass airflow through the throttle plate at a given throttle opening.
It does not matter what turbo you fit on there, it is always going to be nearly the same for a given opening at the same pressure and air temperature in the instances where the throttle is limiting the engine.
And msnwdk is corrected by pressure pre-throttle plate.

The map you need to edit is WDKUGDN, MSN/WDK only need axis extending in some cases.

This assumes everyone scales their MAF's appropriately. IMO, you should always check it to make sure that in the event of a failure calculations will be realistic.
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prj
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« Reply #87 on: March 30, 2016, 09:03:33 AM »

What does this say on spool in a BIG turbo application?
Nothing whatsoever. The throttle is just an orifice and the map describes how much it can flow until the flow speed hits the speed of sound and chokes at different positions.
This map does not work in a turbo application because you are missing the pre-throttle pressure multiplication.
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nyet
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« Reply #88 on: March 30, 2016, 10:51:15 AM »

This map does not work in a turbo application because you are missing the pre-throttle pressure multiplication.

I still don't understand why people insist that you can just throw FI onto any old NA hardware and expect to keep the same ECU.
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ME7.1 tuning guide (READ FIRST)
ECUx Plot
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Please do not ask me for tunes. I'm here to help people make their own.

Do not PM me technical questions! Please, ask all questions on the forums! Doing so will ensure the next person with the same issue gets the opportunity to learn from your experience.
prj
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« Reply #89 on: March 30, 2016, 02:08:35 PM »

I still don't understand why people insist that you can just throw FI onto any old NA hardware and expect to keep the same ECU.
You can keep the same ECU, but you need to make modifications to code.
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