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julex
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« Reply #30 on: August 02, 2013, 12:29:16 PM »
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Correct.
Cool, I see what you were saying. Around 1.40 pressure ratio (6psi, stock WG cracking pressure) is where some cells start exceeding PSPVDKUG threshold. I will take my 21psi, which is 2.44 pressure ration and scale vpssplg_w axis by 2.44/1.40 ratio and take it from there. Beer on me  |
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britishturbo
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« Reply #31 on: August 02, 2013, 12:29:31 PM »
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It is probably my set up specific. I see that I am getting turbo stutter (surging) when I go light-medium part throttle and car gets too excited with throttle and allows boost up to say 15psi and then rapidly cuts off throttle to bring boost down so that load matches limit.
At this point of time, say at 5psi, the turbos start stuttering/surging in waves, cha, cha, cha, cha in sometimes run-away fashion (amplifying with each cycle). I see in logs exactly what is happening...
PRJ's insight into the throttle regulation FUEREG will allow me to properly tune this problem by making car aware that wastegates cracking pressure is much higher than it thinks it is.
I don't have problems if I request hefty amount of load to begin with, like gas pedal deep in so that I reach 15psi for example. No surging then.
I just want a car super smooth in all load points with no on-off switch 95% of 2.7t tuned engines provide...
You want me to take a look at your file and see if I see anything that I could help with? I have seen frankenturbo cars do just that what you describe on "someones" tune... I flashed one of my tunes on and it went away. |
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julex
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« Reply #32 on: August 02, 2013, 12:37:35 PM »
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You want me to take a look at your file and see if I see anything that I could help with?
I have seen frankenturbo cars do just that what you describe on "someones" tune... I flashed one of my tunes on and it went away.
Thanks but I hope I finally have the solution to this. If not, I will take you on the offer, maybe you can tell me what stupid things I did  |
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britishturbo
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« Reply #33 on: August 02, 2013, 12:40:12 PM »
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Thanks but I hope I finally have the solution to this. If not, I will take you on the offer, maybe you can tell me what stupid things I did Let me know... often a fresh pair of eyes can see something you overlooked! |
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julex
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« Reply #34 on: August 03, 2013, 06:22:27 PM »
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prj, hats off for you mate.
After tweaking KFVPDKSD/E maps (as well as WDKUGDN, KFWDKMSN, KFMSNWDK) my car in finally super smooth. I can reach any boost I want, from 0 to 34 by simply pressing pedal appropriately deep enough without weird overshoots or throttle cuts etc. Previously my car was either light load (below 1psi) or wot, anything in between was a lottery, it would either reach and sustain (most of times after overboost and TC) or start doing stupid stuff.
Cheers.
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britishturbo
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« Reply #35 on: August 03, 2013, 06:27:46 PM »
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prj, hats off for you mate.
After tweaking KFVPDKSD/E maps (as well as WDKUGDN, KFWDKMSN, KFMSNWDK) my car in finally super smooth. I can reach any boost I want, from 0 to 34 by simply pressing pedal appropriately deep enough without weird overshoots or throttle cuts etc. Previously my car was either light load (below 1psi) or wot, anything in between was a lottery, it would either reach and sustain (most of times after overboost and TC) or start doing stupid stuff.
Cheers.
Glad you got it working well! I'll have to take a look at those maps. I don't have WDKUGDN or KSMSNWDK in any of my xdfs though, what do you have for their locations and settings if you don't mind? |
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julex
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« Reply #36 on: August 03, 2013, 06:48:36 PM »
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I use PRJ's XDF whenever I am missing something, just FIY. The one he programmatically generated from euro OLS and inferred map locations in M-box. There are some things off in it but not hard to fix when time comes. WDKUGDN: <XDFTABLE uniqueid="0x14B56" flags="0x0">
<title>WDKUGDN - Throttle angle for free flow (adjust for bigger throttle!)</title>
<description>Defines throttle angle beyond which there is no free-flow restriction.

Adjust for bigger throttle rougly by area increase of throttle.</description>
<CATEGORYMEM index="0" category="5" />
<XDFAXIS id="x" uniqueid="0x0">
<EMBEDDEDDATA mmedelementsizebits="16" mmedmajorstridebits="-32" mmedminorstridebits="0" />
<indexcount>1</indexcount>
<datatype>0</datatype>
<unittype>0</unittype>
<DALINK index="0" />
<LABEL index="0" value="0.00" />
<MATH equation="X">
<VAR id="X" />
</MATH>
</XDFAXIS>
<XDFAXIS id="y" uniqueid="0x0">
<EMBEDDEDDATA mmedelementsizebits="16" mmedmajorstridebits="-32" mmedminorstridebits="0" />
<indexcount>12</indexcount>
<embedinfo type="3" linkobjid="0x100A4" />
<datatype>0</datatype>
<unittype>0</unittype>
<DALINK index="0" />
<MATH equation="X">
<VAR id="X" />
</MATH>
</XDFAXIS>
<XDFAXIS id="z">
<EMBEDDEDDATA mmedtypeflags="0x02" mmedaddress="0x14B56" mmedelementsizebits="16" mmedrowcount="12" mmedmajorstridebits="0" mmedminorstridebits="0" />
<decimalpl>2</decimalpl>
<min>0.000000</min>
<max>255.000000</max>
<outputtype>1</outputtype>
<MATH equation="-0.000000+X*0.001526">
<VAR id="X" />
</MATH>
</XDFAXIS>
</XDFTABLE>
<XDFTABLE uniqueid="0x100A4" flags="0x0">
<title>SNM12FEUB - RPMs for WDKSMX, WDKUGDN</title>
<CATEGORYMEM index="0" category="5" />
<XDFAXIS id="x" uniqueid="0x0">
<EMBEDDEDDATA mmedelementsizebits="16" mmedmajorstridebits="-32" mmedminorstridebits="0" />
<indexcount>1</indexcount>
<datatype>0</datatype>
<unittype>0</unittype>
<DALINK index="0" />
<LABEL index="0" value="0.00" />
<MATH equation="X">
<VAR id="X" />
</MATH>
</XDFAXIS>
<XDFAXIS id="y" uniqueid="0x0">
<EMBEDDEDDATA mmedelementsizebits="16" mmedmajorstridebits="-32" mmedminorstridebits="0" />
<indexcount>12</indexcount>
<datatype>0</datatype>
<unittype>0</unittype>
<DALINK index="0" />
<LABEL index="0" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="1" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="2" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="3" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="4" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="5" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="6" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="7" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="8" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="9" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="10" value="0.00" />
<LABEL index="11" value="0.00" />
<MATH equation="X">
<VAR id="X" />
</MATH>
</XDFAXIS>
<XDFAXIS id="z">
<EMBEDDEDDATA mmedaddress="0x100A4" mmedelementsizebits="8" mmedrowcount="12" mmedmajorstridebits="0" mmedminorstridebits="0" />
<decimalpl>1</decimalpl>
<min>0.000000</min>
<max>255.000000</max>
<outputtype>1</outputtype>
<MATH equation="-0.000000+X*40.000000">
<VAR id="X" />
</MATH>
</XDFAXIS>
</XDFTABLE> KFMSNWDK: <XDFTABLE uniqueid="0x0" flags="0x0">
<title>KFMSNWDK</title>
<description>Normalized mass flow over DK</description>
<CATEGORYMEM index="0" category="5" />
<XDFAXIS id="x" uniqueid="0x0">
<EMBEDDEDDATA mmedtypeflags="0x02" mmedaddress="0x1469A" mmedelementsizebits="16" mmedcolcount="6" mmedmajorstridebits="16" mmedminorstridebits="0" />
<units>U/min</units>
<indexcount>6</indexcount>
<decimalpl>3</decimalpl>
<embedinfo type="1" />
<datatype>0</datatype>
<unittype>0</unittype>
<DALINK index="0" />
<MATH equation="0.250000 * X">
<VAR id="X" />
</MATH>
</XDFAXIS>
<XDFAXIS id="y" uniqueid="0x0">
<EMBEDDEDDATA mmedtypeflags="0x02" mmedaddress="0x1467A" mmedelementsizebits="16" mmedcolcount="16" mmedmajorstridebits="16" mmedminorstridebits="0" />
<units>%</units>
<indexcount>16</indexcount>
<decimalpl>3</decimalpl>
<embedinfo type="1" />
<datatype>0</datatype>
<unittype>0</unittype>
<DALINK index="0" />
<MATH equation="0.001526 * X">
<VAR id="X" />
</MATH>
</XDFAXIS>
<XDFAXIS id="z">
<EMBEDDEDDATA mmedtypeflags="0x02" mmedaddress="0x146A6" mmedelementsizebits="16" mmedrowcount="16" mmedcolcount="6" mmedmajorstridebits="0" mmedminorstridebits="0" />
<units>kg/h</units>
<decimalpl>2</decimalpl>
<min>0.000000</min>
<max>255.000000</max>
<outputtype>1</outputtype>
<MATH equation="0.100000 * X">
<VAR id="X" />
</MATH>
</XDFAXIS>
</XDFTABLE> |
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« Last Edit: August 03, 2013, 07:44:19 PM by julex »
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prj
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« Reply #37 on: August 05, 2013, 01:45:53 PM »
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prj, hats off for you mate.
After tweaking KFVPDKSD/E maps (as well as WDKUGDN, KFWDKMSN, KFMSNWDK) my car in finally super smooth. I can reach any boost I want, from 0 to 34 by simply pressing pedal appropriately deep enough without weird overshoots or throttle cuts etc. Previously my car was either light load (below 1psi) or wot, anything in between was a lottery, it would either reach and sustain (most of times after overboost and TC) or start doing stupid stuff.
Cheers.
As it should be... It's the little things that make all the difference, and it's the little things that take the most time. Anyone can map a car to run with the pedal to the floor, but it takes quite a bit of effort to make it feel like a normal vehicle in day-to-day activities. In the world of dyno plot e-peen waggling people often forget this. |
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julex
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« Reply #38 on: August 06, 2013, 08:20:46 AM »
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As it should be...
It's the little things that make all the difference, and it's the little things that take the most time.
Anyone can map a car to run with the pedal to the floor, but it takes quite a bit of effort to make it feel like a normal vehicle in day-to-day activities.
In the world of dyno plot e-peen waggling people often forget this.
You're absolutely right. I've seen so many great dyno plots when the car barely idles and/or drives like crap in any other than WOT area. |
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Snow Trooper
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« Reply #39 on: August 08, 2013, 07:58:13 PM »
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cartoons?
6A 61 72 65 64 40 76 6C 6D 73 70 65 63
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julex
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« Reply #40 on: August 09, 2013, 06:48:17 AM »
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And what turbos, intake, etc? Looks to me like small intake and relatively small turbos with low wastegate cracking pressure? (but for that I would have to see kfldrl/kfldimx table ofc). |
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« Last Edit: August 09, 2013, 07:30:03 AM by julex »
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Snow Trooper
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« Reply #41 on: August 09, 2013, 08:59:53 AM »
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That particular file is on a car with a big single, RS4/2.8 intake stuff and a 21 Psi gate that becomes 23 Psi through the n75 at no duty cycle. Runs very smooth and predictably.
Edit, why do you think small intake?
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« Last Edit: August 09, 2013, 10:43:07 AM by Snow Trooper »
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cartoons?
6A 61 72 65 64 40 76 6C 6D 73 70 65 63
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julex
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« Reply #42 on: August 09, 2013, 11:56:56 AM »
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Edit, why do you think small intake?
Stock IM with stock throttle mainly. |
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Snow Trooper
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« Reply #43 on: August 09, 2013, 12:09:42 PM »
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Look closer, stock values are higher on the air flow over throttle plate. It's scaled down from RS4.
Also some values go down for the larger tb as opposed to up.
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cartoons?
6A 61 72 65 64 40 76 6C 6D 73 70 65 63
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Rabbid
Full Member
Karma: +0/-0
 Offline
Posts: 55
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« Reply #44 on: September 02, 2013, 06:38:33 AM »
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Interesting reading, had a car come to me at the weekend with a 25psi crack pressure on the actuator when we tested it though would run about 17psi at 0% duty.
Had some interesting issues with the car shutting the throttle once we raised the boost up. Will do some more research next time I see the car and report back.
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