s60rawr
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« Reply #2340 on: July 07, 2023, 02:15:33 PM »
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i'm sad this thread has devolved into such a pissing contest. but then thats the nature of the tuning scene isnt it, make people less willing to share what they learn :/
Its sad the Volvo community is like this..
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xM1ke
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« Reply #2341 on: July 08, 2023, 01:22:42 PM »
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What would be the correct KRKTE value to run green injectors in a 4T5 engine? I first used the stock R value (0.07235), but it didn't result in a smooth idle (obviously, as the displacement of both engines is different). Using the ME7 KRKTE calculator, I am now running a value of 0.06889, which results in a smoother idle but the engine is still bouncing rpm sometimes.
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keichi
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« Reply #2342 on: July 08, 2023, 01:39:27 PM »
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What would be the correct KRKTE value to run green injectors in a 4T5 engine? I first used the stock R value (0.07235), but it didn't result in a smooth idle (obviously, as the displacement of both engines is different). Using the ME7 KRKTE calculator, I am now running a value of 0.06889, which results in a smoother idle but the engine is still bouncing rpm sometimes.
NEW_KRKTE = (OLD_FLOW * OLD_KRKTE) / NEW_FLOW No need to use any calculator any factor for KRKTE etc. Just use pure HEX value from BIN (convert it to decimal for convenience and back to hex). |
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xM1ke
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« Reply #2343 on: July 09, 2023, 06:32:28 AM »
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NEW_KRKTE = (OLD_FLOW * OLD_KRKTE) / NEW_FLOW
No need to use any calculator any factor for KRKTE etc.
Just use pure HEX value from BIN (convert it to decimal for convenience and back to hex).
That formula is spot on; NEW_KRKTE = (368.4 * 0.08193) / 446.7 = 0.06757. The difference in value is close to the what the long term fuel trim correction (-1.5%) was using my old KRKTE value of 0.06889. This might not be the explanation that my engine sometimes has a jumpy idle, could a bad MAF be another option? |
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prometey1982
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« Reply #2344 on: July 09, 2023, 07:58:06 AM »
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That formula is spot on; NEW_KRKTE = (368.4 * 0.08193) / 446.7 = 0.06757. The difference in value is close to the what the long term fuel trim correction (-1.5%) was using my old KRKTE value of 0.06889. This might not be the explanation that my engine sometimes has a jumpy idle, could a bad MAF be another option?
I have same behaviour on idle on cold engine with lean burn. When I start moving with rotated wheels without touching the throttle revs sometimes drops and restores. I think it happens due to 2.4 engine with R flash. At least KISRM should be adjusted to different displacement. And maybe KFPRG and KFURL maps. |
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prj
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« Reply #2345 on: July 09, 2023, 02:58:14 PM »
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KFPRG/KFURL irrelevant if you are using MAF.
KISRM mostly irrelevant, it's only a rate of change limiter for ps_w.
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keichi
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« Reply #2346 on: July 09, 2023, 03:35:54 PM »
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That formula is spot on; NEW_KRKTE = (368.4 * 0.08193) / 446.7 = 0.06757. The difference in value is close to the what the long term fuel trim correction (-1.5%) was using my old KRKTE value of 0.06889. This might not be the explanation that my engine sometimes has a jumpy idle, could a bad MAF be another option?
What model year do you have and what engine? If you switched from "blue" to "green" injectors then you still have wrong KRKTE  Do not use flow values found somewhere on the internet - they are all wrong because they vary a lot depending on test medium, pressure and units Bosch gives precise flow for their injectors in the same units and medium@pressure. Use them. For blue it's 261,2 and green 310,1. So your KRKTE should be 0,06902. Fuel trims at low injection times may be wrong because you also should change TVUB - injector dead times. For greens they are slightly lower then for blues - at least looking at stock S60R and 2.3T5 software. And about jumpy idle. Check injection times on idle. Maybe you are at injector non-linear flow area. Green injectors have poor linearity on low injection times. I was struggling with rough idle in my 2.3 T5 with green injectors. When i switched to Bosch 550cc (newer construction i belive) it is much better - they have better linearity at very low injection times. |
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« Last Edit: July 09, 2023, 03:41:33 PM by keichi »
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xM1ke
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« Reply #2347 on: July 15, 2023, 03:13:45 AM »
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I have same behaviour on idle on cold engine with lean burn. When I start moving with rotated wheels without touching the throttle revs sometimes drops and restores. I think it happens due to 2.4 engine with R flash. At least KISRM should be adjusted to different displacement. And maybe KFPRG and KFURL maps.
My map is based on a stock 50GPHJ bin from a T5 2.4, and I had the same issue (only with a cold engine). I haven’t had the drop in rpm since changing the KRKTE to 0.06757, however, it has been relatively hot in Europe, so it might be temperature related. What model year do you have and what engine? If you switched from "blue" to "green" injectors then you still have wrong KRKTE Do not use flow values found somewhere on the internet - they are all wrong because they vary a lot depending on test medium, pressure and units Bosch gives precise flow for their injectors in the same units and medium@pressure. Use them. For blue it's 261,2 and green 310,1. So your KRKTE should be 0,06902. Fuel trims at low injection times may be wrong because you also should change TVUB - injector dead times. For greens they are slightly lower then for blues - at least looking at stock S60R and 2.3T5 software. And about jumpy idle. Check injection times on idle. Maybe you are at injector non-linear flow area. Green injectors have poor linearity on low injection times. I was struggling with rough idle in my 2.3 T5 with green injectors. When i switched to Bosch 550cc (newer construction i belive) it is much better - they have better linearity at very low injection times. I am using green injectors in a 2.4 T5. Flow rates may be different because of the different fuel pressure? For example, my stock value for blue injectors is 368.4. In R bin files, the flow rate of the green injectors is 446.7, so that is why I used that flow rate. TVUB is similar, I believe. |
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« Last Edit: July 15, 2023, 03:16:44 AM by xM1ke »
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keichi
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« Reply #2348 on: July 15, 2023, 03:26:55 AM »
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I am using green injectors in a 2.4 T5. Flow rates may be different because of the different fuel pressure? For example, my stock value for blue injectors is 368.4. In R bin files, the flow rate of the green injectors is 446.7, so that is why I used that flow rate. TVUB is similar, I believe.
You can measure injector flow in many different ways at whole range of pressures. When you set KRKTE and only thing you change are injectors it doesn't matter what is your cars fuel rail pressure, engine displacement etc. Only test bench measured flow for new and old injector matters. People used to give flow numbers in cc/min and green injectors are told to be around 440 but this is totally irrelevant and actually wrong This number doesn't mean anything and you MUST NOT use it for any calculations - treat it just as an alternative name for green injector. It can be "Injectors 440" or "Injectors over 9000" or "Injector bilion" or whatever Just look at BOSCH data sheet and get flow numbers they provide. BOSCH measure flow of their injectors in totally different way but it doesn't matter Just take those number from BOSCH and put them into the equation: NEW_KRKTE = (OLD_FLOW * OLD_KRKTE) / NEW_FLOW |
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acoffinship
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« Reply #2349 on: July 15, 2023, 11:55:43 AM »
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Hey guys, it's been a while. Much to catch up on and lots of re-reading to do for me.  So I bought a 2001 V70 T5 FWD automatic last year. And now I want a little more out of it. I don't want to do anything fancy for this car as it has a high mileage, is a FWD and automatic. If I want to raise boost a little, say, max 1.1 bar from about 3k to 5.5k RPMs and taper off to about 0.8 bar at 6200+, is it enough just to bump LDRXN values, or should I also adjust LAMFA? Or is it vital to also touch maps like KFLDHBN and KFZW? As I'm saying, I'm not expecting to make anything fancy out of this car. When I wanted a little more out of my 2.4T MT, vwdenisvw suggested: "The boost can be increased to 0.8 bar with standard injectors 831. For a start, it's enough to simply increase the ldrxn values. And adjust a little afr to 0.87-0.9 in lamfa. For all stock, this will be enough."I adjusted LDRXN a little (about 0.72 bar max) and didn't touch LAMFA. STFTs and LTFTs seemed fine, as well as AFRs. I could feel the car was "more alive", but also a little more hungry for fuel. The gearbox in my T5 is Aisin AW55-50. I'm reading that there is a 350 Nm torque limitation on 1st and 2nd gears, is it true? I'm also reading that this gearbox isn't very robust. So I'm thinking if it's worth raising boost at all. Although mine still works fine and the oil is nice and red (seems it has been serviced fine). |
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« Last Edit: July 15, 2023, 12:42:14 PM by acoffinship »
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acoffinship
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« Reply #2350 on: July 15, 2023, 11:57:22 AM »
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Sharing my stock bin file.
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Dannyhaddon
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« Reply #2351 on: July 16, 2023, 02:42:40 AM »
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Hey guys, it's been a while. Much to catch up on and lots of re-reading to do for me. So I bought a 2001 V70 T5 FWD automatic last year. And now I want a little more out of it. I don't want to do anything fancy for this car as it has a high mileage, is a FWD and automatic. If I want to raise boost a little, say, max 1.1 bar from about 3k to 5.5k RPMs and taper off to about 0.8 bar at 6200+, is it enough just to bump LDRXN values, or should I also adjust LAMFA? Or is it vital to also touch maps like KFLDHBN and KFZW? As I'm saying, I'm not expecting to make anything fancy out of this car. When I wanted a little more out of my 2.4T MT, vwdenisvw suggested: "The boost can be increased to 0.8 bar with standard injectors 831. For a start, it's enough to simply increase the ldrxn values. And adjust a little afr to 0.87-0.9 in lamfa. For all stock, this will be enough."I adjusted LDRXN a little (about 0.72 bar max) and didn't touch LAMFA. STFTs and LTFTs seemed fine, as well as AFRs. I could feel the car was "more alive", but also a little more hungry for fuel. The gearbox in my T5 is Aisin AW55-50. I'm reading that there is a 350 Nm torque limitation on 1st and 2nd gears, is it true? I'm also reading that this gearbox isn't very robust. So I'm thinking if it's worth raising boost at all. Although mine still works fine and the oil is nice and red (seems it has been serviced fine). You will need to change kfmirl/iop and also change the waste gate settings (kfldimx) along with the ldrxn values |
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« Last Edit: July 16, 2023, 02:48:27 AM by Dannyhaddon »
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keichi
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« Reply #2352 on: July 16, 2023, 05:40:28 AM »
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You will need to change kfmirl/iop and also change the waste gate settings (kfldimx) along with the ldrxn values
Stock MIOP/MIRL load axis is up to 180. This is sufficient for 1.3bar tapering to 1,15 at redline. This is more then stock 16T is capable of so no need to change that on stock turbo. |
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Dannyhaddon
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« Reply #2353 on: July 16, 2023, 01:47:45 PM »
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Stock MIOP/MIRL load axis is up to 180. This is sufficient for 1.3bar tapering to 1,15 at redline. This is more then stock 16T is capable of so no need to change that on stock turbo.
Only just seen the file, I think just change some lxdrn to 167 and add 0.9 to fueling and it's a quick upgrade |
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keichi
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« Reply #2354 on: July 17, 2023, 01:23:15 AM »
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Only just seen the file, I think just change some lxdrn to 167 and add 0.9 to fueling and it's a quick upgrade
Beware of adjusting LAMFA or BTS Stock those maps are set to 1,0 and fueling rely mostly on ATR and DLBTS (do not confuse with LBTS). Setting fuel in LAMFA and LBTS only cause massive overfueling on longer pulls. |
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